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Just because you don’t see it doesn’t mean it’s not there.

Posting here and realizing that my experience was not unique has been a cathartic experience for me.

So your saying there are no lurkers? I lurked around here for years before leaving TWI in 2008 and when I started positing here in 2009. Beguiled just said he lurks around here and seldom posts but every few years. Im with T-Bone. I will contine to rebut mike's points of view. GSC helped free me from the clutches of the way international, an abusive cult and most all of that was done when I was lurking but too high profile in TWI to post. Heck, I worked and was close with WayGB while I was at HQ and regularly say the stacks of printed out pages of grease spot cafe that he was preparing for rosalie because she wouldnt use computers. So, I couldnt post here or he woulda known it was me hands down. You can bet your level best that the way international still has people watching this site. They are looking for anything they can use to shut GSC down, and that Im willing to take to the bank. I will readily debate anyone coming on this site with pro-way international posts and I do it to keep the forums from becoming an unintelligible mess, which seems to be the goal for some folks.

A worthy endeavor. Not necessarily something the person you addressed cares about at all, however. Then again, sometimes just making the declaration itself is therapeutic.

What makes you think my intent is to get through Mike’s impenetrable confirmation bias? Oh, maybe you’re using the “to whom is it addressed?” nonsense of PFAL/Bullinger. I have my reasons for the way I say things – and I’m not really interested in hearing about your rules and preferences for my voice. If you’re the self-designated thread monitor, I hope you don’t get frustrated or feel insulted that I ignore your silly - - comments. If you are a moderator, please do something official like cite the GSC rules I am violating or ban me, or do something that will appease your ire. I’m easy – I’ll move on – I've got better things to do than argue with someone over my voice. This isn’t the way corps program, and you are not my superior. Perhaps what you imagine is different from what I think.

Why am I suddenly flashing back to Hogan's Heroes? "I know NOTHING!"

His only begotten ….. bath water? No that’s not it. His only begotten collaterals? Wait. I know the answer to this it’s right on the tip of my tongue.

It’s not a baby. It’s a rotting corpse.

Hi Mike – perhaps someday you’ll understand how one’s perception of wierwille was shaped by how much of a composite image is formed from seeing his different sides. It is not just his public persona but how he behaved in unguarded moments and further if one has had the unfortunate experience of being sexually molested by him. I’ve learned in life we are initially known by our words, but over time our deeds either support our words - or they nullify our words and sabotage our efforts to influence others. Identifying folks by their deeds takes some practice Matthew 7:16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? (biblehub.com). Of course, Matthew 7:16 is in reference to spotting false prophets – but getting a general idea of whether someone is good or bad is a practical principle one can abstract from that verse as well. Just wanted to explain this to you over the times you go on and on how we’re all sinners - and I agree! but you also talk about folks on Grease Spot being too harsh on wierwille- maybe without realizing there's a whole other side - a darker side of wierwille that you were not aware of. I think you use absolute thinking – or black and white thinking. That myopic view does not take into account the biblical data that suggests some sins are worse than others and the consequences of some sins are more destructive than others. That being said – since you have not been through the corps program you have never witnessed wierwille in unguarded moments – instances of wierwille doing and saying stuff that would indicate bad judgement on his part – stuff that, to the uninitiated would surely offend , horrify, or even shock them that the teacher of PFAL would behave this way . For example, the pajama party with wierwille at Rome City showing a porn video to the corps under the pretext of preparing us to counsel anyone even those who work in the porn industry or are into watching porn... ...Or the time he was in the Rome City Coachman Suite, sexually molesting Kristen – as mentioned in her book… These incidents present a different side of him that you have not witnessed or experienced. You can read about the horrifying stories of wierwille’s depraved behavior – but if you’ve never been there to experience them – it can seem like exaggerated or fabricated stories – because it doesn’t agree with how you’ve experienced the nice, warm and fuzzy prim and proper wierwille. I don’t expect you to flat out believe the accounts of wierwille’s depravity shared on Grease Spot. But I wish you would have some respect for what former corps have shared here – realizing that they may have a more complete picture of the real wierwille even though it disagrees with your romanticized and sanitized version that was presented to the general TWI public. But that doesn’t let you off the hook. I know you know in your heart there’s some dark and ominous underpinnings to wierwille’s ministry. But love and admiration can blind someone to another’s faults. People usually find what they’re looking for. I know you’ve been around TWI from a long time ago. Surely in all that time – I can’t imagine you’ve never met a woman who had been sexually molested by wierwille and may have tried to relate to you something so horrible that happened to her - but she couldn't find the words or courage to make herself vulnerable ...people would attack her for starting rumors or attacking wierwille's ministry...wierwille would say stuff to cause people to doubt any negative words about him ---for instance I know you've heard him say about those who have criticized him or complain about some horrible thing he did , that's how the adversary always works to cause division - - they did it to Jesus, did it to Paul...or maybe you heard about that happening to someone you knew. You should dust off those old memories and ignored red flags. Seek and you will find.

Bolshevik I’m calling out your victim blaming bs. I have taught University courses for a long time now and have been taught for 42 years. I know the type of person you are. I know how your thinking works (or doesn’t). You are not smart or provocative. All of your anecdotal claims are dubious opinions that don’t originate in anything near a logical mindset. Your social currency is doxa, mine is episteme. You are a troll, plain and simple. You have a singular belief that you have not shared which allows you to think you are above everyone else here and that everyone here is hindering our families in TWI. So what was done to your family that is currently in TWI? Nothing has happened to mine. Bam, my anecdotal evidence proves yours is wrong. /s *facepalm* I am a PFAL, AOP Advance class grad, born to my parents while they were in the Corps, later I went into the Family Corps with my parents and brother. My parents gave up their land, homes, horses, and investments to go back into the Family Corps. Once we were in Rome City they controlled our lives every second of every day. When I was raped in the FC they probably held no power over my 7th grade self either. Clearly that was my fault and I was not one with god. Only VPW and LCM’s dick can give godly power to those that “need” it. When we were sitting under the big tent at the RoA waiting to hear where we would go WoW and then to have the entire program cancelled they probably held no control over my family. We were in the middle of the RoA, now homeless and penniless and at the mercy of whatever Loy decided to do with us. The Milgram Experiment shows time and time again that it does not matter what walk of life you come from, you will listen and obey authority. Two out of three people will, every single time, and will give no regard to the consequences of others as long as the authoritarian figure says everything is ok. If we, the victims, do not document what happened to us THEN THE CYCLE WILL CONTINUE AND IN ANOTHER THOUSAND YEARS PEOPLE WILL FALL FOR THE SAME BULLCRAP. This is literally education 101 in high school, middle school? Any and all harm that comes to people, family, and friends still in TWI is NOT OUR FAULT. We control our actions and cannot control the retaliatorial actions of others because we are speaking out on our truths. You are literally blaming the victim. My parents will die with TWI in their hearts and minds before me and my brother cross their minds. GSC might actually reach someone close to them and help them understand their errors. You blame those seeking help and answers when TWI took away their ability to gain an education and to use logical reasoning. If you were in TWI for a long period of time (read decades) and as a youth then your lack of intelligence, sympathy, empathy, and can be explained then I too am sorry that they stole time from you so that you could get a better education and perspective on what you think you are saying. Which of course, no one knows what you are saying but you. Because in the end you aren’t saying anything. You are just being a thorn in our flesh because you don’t know how to help yourself or those close to you. Well guess what, the answers are here if you can get past the fact that we all will have some lingering effects in our beliefs, our thought processes, and the language we use because of TWI. So what evidence do you have that these websites influence those around our families? And more importantly, do you not understand that that is not our problem? We are here speaking truths about what has happened to us, period. If you are not strong enough or mature enough to hear the truth of how TWI has hurt so many people, then it is I who feel sorry for you. Of the most fundamental truths that I have learned as a teacher, it is that you are projecting. You are acting just like a “wafer” but you have your sights on a different target. Or really the same, right? Because you are attacking ex-TWI-ers just like the TWI does. I have been a University professor and have read the peer-reviewed research on this and many topics for over a decade. The research proves time and time again that we must always find the truth of a matter before we can begin healing for ourselves, let alone others. Sure, people on this site .... me off and I wish they would stop using old terminology or would just “get over it.” But you know what? At the end of the day we were all robbed of our time. Time we could have been spending elsewhere improving our education, our families, our careers, et cetera. So I understand why people act the way they do and you know what I do when I get frustrated, I walk away for a bit (read years lol). But every time I am at a crossroads in my life and every time I cannot find a way to move forward I end up at GSC and unwrap something new that I didn’t know needed healing. GSC has been THE ONLY SOURCE OF HEALING AND SUPPORT FOR ME FOR THE PAST 15 YEARS and I only post a couple times every few years. I am a ghost around here and yet this community of like-minded individuals is needed for those of us truly destroyed by TWI. You have chosen to continue to be a “wafer” even though you are outside of their garden. You have chosen to be ethnocentric and ignorant to feed your ego. Sound like anyone we know? You speak in riddles that have no discernible thesis nor conclusion. (Btw, this is documented in peer-reviewed research as being a cornerstone of the uneducated mind.) VPW’s Life Lines comes to mind. Those of us who are PFAL and AOP grads are not continuing to act out our training in any way, shape, or form. Please give me ONE example of how we are. If anything it is YOU who are still emulating the condescending nature that we all learned in TWI. I was trained in those classes to be on a higher plane that those around me. I know the truth and they don’t so clearly I am superior and thus my questions and answers will sound pompous to others, yet profane to myself. I was taught that it was our way or the highway and if you don’t like it then I’m sorry to hear that. SOUND LIKE ANYONE AROUND THIS SITE? (Spoiler Alert: It’s you…) You say that “our one job is to forget.” Once again talking out of your foot and proclaiming what I should do, just like TWI. You do understand that forgetting and not speaking up is tantamount to enabling those who caused us harm, right? You understand that the peer-reviewed research proclaims time and time again that we as a society must document and not forget, lest our sins come back to bite us. Jfc this is common knowledge outside of academia. You are purposely being obtuse or you do not realize that you are just like those that you think you have broken free from. You have almost 8k posts in which you are showing your ignorance over and over again. It is you who are the problem. You need a slap in the face to show you that YOU ARE STILL ACTING LIKE A WAFER (I hate this term but TWI-er doesn't roll of the tongue). You are close-minded, uneducated, and quick to dismiss, only interject half conversations, and speak in riddles all while thinking highly of yourself and putting down others. It's passive aggressive bullying at its finest, whether you realize it or not. I mean I’d go on but jfc the parallels are glaringly obvious. “When the birds are silent the rest of us don't have to consider them.” I think this every time I see you post. We are here for healing. You are here for pointing fingers anywhere but towards yourself. It’s exhausting and why I am on a rant. I give people like you ZERO chances. You either know what you are or you do not. If you don’t then this will be a wake-up call and I'll gladly eat crow. If you do then you will reply in unorganized thoughts and riddles that may or may not have relevance towards acknowledging the healing that truth brings around here and that you are coooooonstantly victim blaming and putting the onus of responsibility on anyone but yourself. You do not deserve my respect but I have given it to you, barely. I couldn’t care less how you reply to me. I can take anything you can dish out. I live in FL if you want to do it in person. I’m not a keyboard warrior like you so I’ll gladly show you how your thinking is wrong if you’d like. But in the meantime, stfu and recognize that this site is for those of us who are .... hurting from TWI’s .... and we don’t have more time for it here. We will speak the truth and if that truth hurts your family members, or my family members, it is NOT OUR FAULT. You are a TWI apologist at this point. The fact that others are cordial with you and you are not with them speaks volumes. (I am well aware of my supposed hypocrisy to this point at the moment, but sometimes I need to step out of line to get others back in.) I am not a regular so I don’t gaf who I .... off. And even if I was I still wouldn’t care. I am a victim of many things and will not put up with your pseudo-intellectual doxa when my intellectual episteme already shows me what this site is and who you are. This site has helped my life and my family, you have not helped anyone or anything. PERIOD. “Posting to the internet always has unintended consequences.” Let me help you out kid. Every single action we do as mammals, let alone human beings, has latent consequences. We are not responsible for said consequences. We can only control our own thoughts and actions. Every time you post one of you 7k plus comments you think you are being sly, slick, and mighty. But the reality is that you are showing those of us around here why we need this place every time you show your foot. You should be thanking those around here for their hard work, time, patience, money, et cetera. Yes there are a lot of egos and I don’t like most of them around here, but that’s my own personal shortcoming, not theirs. I literally come to GSC every 3-5 years and I GET HEALING EACH AND EVERY TIME. You are on here every day and spew vile everywhere I look. Again, as an educated person it is clear you project. I hope you can start to see that. You know you could help those you think need helping instead of complaining that those that "could" hurt your family are using this place of healing as ammo. It’s not our fault that people lurk for information to hurt others. Do not blame the victim. Do not protect the perpetrator. GSC does not harm indiscriminately. It heals indiscriminately. When a website can provide more powerful healing than a lifetime of being in TWI, then of course there will be those who seek to hurt and dismantle us. When you go on reddit or whatever .... echo chamber you hide in while on the ‘net, do you tell them to stop talking about the subject because they are harming people? When you proclaim “my post you already read is clear, I think you are deliberately being ignorant on this chockful” you are not being anything but a smug and ineffectual communicator, let alone whatever else you think you are. And for the third or fourth time I will let you know that you are projecting your inadequacies onto the people replying to you. It is not up to us to determine what you mean. It is up to you. If we cannot understand your thesis, let alone your thoughts because you cannot sufficiently communicate them, then you need to take a step back and once again acknowledge it is you who is in the wrong. You talk about GSC causing harm indiscriminately and when skyrider tells you that you are false you brush him off as not understanding that a bomb doesn’t care who it hurts. Tbone accurately states that it is TWI that is like a bomb. Again, you are projecting. I do not know how long you were or how long you got out, but I’ll say it again: I see no difference between your thoughts, attitude, and words than anyone in TWI. I am 42, I was in TWI for 25 years. Born into the Corp. I know TWI. I know how it and everyone involves works. You have yet to cast your shackles my friend. Until you do I suggest you stop trying to help others. You are harming more than you are helping. We see your mind skipping around and having conversations without us. We see you having thoughts and then spewing half thoughts onto the page. We see you. We see this site. You see neither. Wtf does the world population and PFAL grads have to do with anything? What would they do to us? As a statistician I would love to know what you thought you were doing with numbers lol. You are seriously throwing incomplete thoughts and incomplete conversations at GSC in an attempt to sound like _____ (fill in the blank). So needless to say your 7.7k posts on this site alone have had major latent consequences which include telling me to get over it and that I haven’t experienced healing from GSC in the past 15 years. You need to close your mouth and either get an education or listen to others. Either way, you are doing to us what you claim we are doing to your loved ones. It needs to stop. You need to stop. I could say more but I’ve exhausted myself. Time for warm milk and a nap. Where’s my blanky?!