Twinky

Folks, Shiftthis has been a member here since May 2008 - but he has been a part of TWI for many decades. He's made only 131 posts (as at today) so maybe he doesn't come here often, even as a lurker. He hangs out with innies, with splinter groups... nuff said. Remember how long it took you, once you made the decision to leave, to start to clear your brain of the treacle coursing through its folds. And once you found this place, maybe you were so revolted by what you read that you couldn't believe it either. Be patient with Shiftthis. Eventually he might "get there." Or "get it." Or something. His critical thinking skills are shot to pieces; might not have been brilliant to start with. There's no instant fix for Waybrain. Hey, got an idea. (calls to off-stage) Paw, how about charging for GSC 101 - Power for Abundant Listening? Followed by an Intermediate class in Empathy & Compassion?

It would have been really helpful if part of in rez training had included talks from Jewish leaders - instead of re-runs of PFAL and other classes, and plodding through Light Through an Eastern Window (KC Pillai). A real Jewish understanding could have brought a lot of new perspectives to Christianity. (Oh, dang, there I go again, confusing TWI with a Christian organization.) Luther tried to convert Jews near him to his brand of Christianity. When they wouldn't listen, he turned viciously against them. Sounds familiar?

My thoughts exactly.

Soooo ... has anyone actually looked at their website, or article(s) about kindness? (And don't be unkind, folks. Set an example.)

Doncha like the conclusion "freely show his kindness"? :unsure:

So very right, Excie. Well... not new unless you're in TWI.

My oh my. Don't know why I did this, but I looked at TWI's website just a few moments ago. And on the front page is a little heading (which someone is smart enough to hyperlink) announcing "What's new" and underneath, a big banner announcing "God's Kindness to Others." This is apparently a series of short articles about ... well, God's Kindness. Link to their website (Click at your own peril) A skim of the articles shows lots of Bible verses with descriptive words beneath, usual TWI style. No particular examples of what "kindness" might look or sound or feel like. Leader article concludes as follows: This sounds like such a wonderful thing to be doing. Except that having been on the receiving end of so much "kindness" from TWI, I'd rather be anywhere else ... like being in one of many of the churches in this city, which do know what kindness really is.On the plus side, this Kindness section of their website does look quite well done. Beautifully whitewashed, you might say.

What an awesome character Dr Lee is! A lot of drive to overcome a lot of obstacles. I was appalled at this: Dirty "Whites" water was good enough for these second-rate non-white Americans, when it wasn't good enough for "Whites." Good on Dr Lee for pushing through that junk and showing not only was he the equal of, but in this respect better than, the local White population. Somebody please reassure me that that junk no longer applies.

What's a "brawn bar"? Sounds horrible. I loved those yogurts. Delicious. Most of my in rez twig didn;t. So I acquired theirs. Yum. But then, they got my PBJs. Yeuk.

From the Silly Question > Food at Emporia thread: Too funny!

I watched the opening ceremony last night. Fantastic! A history, a celebration, funny bits, all sorts. Loved the cauldron - never seen anything like that. I've always loved watching the athletes - absolute dedication to what they want to achieve. Not distracted for a second. No woolly thinking. I always wonder how dedicated Christians are to the race set before them. How many would strive even to get to the qualifying heats? Or into the stadium? Much less strive for gold. Or are too many Christians distracted by the world around them? Anyway, enough over-spiritualising. Well done to ALL the athletes for getting to the Olympics. Even to those who are there in a token capacity, with practically no expectation of getting a medal. They did well to get there and they still represent their countries with boldness. :eusa_clap: .. (edited so that the "Olympic rings" are in the right position)

I think a significant problem now (at least for me) is that having listened to a false prophet and his trained false prophets for too long, I'm not entirely sure when I might be listening to a real prophet. One with a genuine, energized ministry. I tend to run whatever that person says through too many layers of filters. Come to that, I have difficulty discerning a real apostle, evangelist, or teacher (real pastors I know about) (and they usually aren't church leadership) without a lot of personal contact.

Naw, OS. That's where the bodies are buried! :B)

What would Linder do with the bloody gun, anyway? TWI is abusive but not so far as I'm aware has it actually got round to actually murdering its members. Yet. Caused people to kill themselves, yes, but killed them actually, no. If Paul had launched himself at LCM, maybe Linder would have shot at him to defend LCM, d'ya think? But Paul was in control of himself and found other actually more devastating ways to attack LCM and TWI. Linder and that gun...so many stories...wonder if it was loaded? If he knew how to use it? Just another way to intimidate and threaten. What a splendid example of Christian love and kindness. What a scenario. Paul gets as red in the face as LCM during a Sunday sermon. Linder thinks Paul is threatening LCM. Linder shoots Paul and kills him. Then, he has to shoot and kill F3rne so that she can't expose this as well. Then, everyone present has to secretly dig a hole in the Way Woods to bury them. Or would they weight the bodies and drop them in the pond? And also they have to clean up the location where this took place. Mmmmm - can't see any of the trustees or their spouses wanting to do that much work, really. And then, Paul's secret letter exposing all the information comes to light when he fails to check in with his lawyer, friends, whoever.

Kit, I’d agree that causing division is not a godly thing. However, I also think that honesty is a Godly thing and we were fed such a line about how marvelous Luther was, how bold, how willing to take a stand… Nobody talked about this side of Luther’s teachings. The Catholic church at Luther’s time was very corrupt. There are many records of this, and I don’t want to address those. That’s what Luther attempted, with his “95 Theses.” The Catholic church today still has its problems (notably abuse of young children) – again, many records, and widely documented nowadays, not so a few decades ago - there is a current thread (Sandusky) on which you have posted. Notwithstanding some very bad apples (abusive priests), I’d agree with you that the Catholic church today is out there helping the less fortunate with schools, orphanages, etc. I can't comment further, Catholics in England do their best to keep separate and not integrate with Protestants. But this thread isn’t about the Catholic church. It’s about a man, Luther, revered by VPW, and whose ideas were incorporated into our “Christian” education within the Way. And I think Luther’s hard, uncompromising, bigoted viewpoint was transmitted to us, not only concerning Jews, but also regarding anyone who wasn’t a Way “believer.”

Someone who doesn’t post here sent me a note with the following: The book is easiest to read on the first link. Not a nice man….

Well, I'd rather like to know where it's from, too. Doesn't sound like the JR that I knew and worked with for a long time. He can spell better than that, too.

Roy, he went through a "learning curve" all right. He started out wanting to save the souls of Jews and convert them to his idea of Christianity. When they didn't follow him, he turned on them. Denounced them and wanted them dead. He learned to hate. Was it his ego that was hurt? Was it because he genuinely thought they were incorrigible? Whatever, his words against Jews are vitriolic. Vile. Inciting others to violence. Not full of the grace that he spouted and claimed was all that was needed. No grace at all.

I found this online: I'd say VPW failed at pretty much all of this. Well...there was observable fruit but not the kind of fruit that most would expect to produce. Just putrid fruit. Homiletics principles

Not entirely sure which forum this ought to be in so if Mods want to move it, that’s fine by me. We’ve all heard of Martin Luther and his valiant stand against the corrupt Catholic church, and the 95 theses that he nailed to the church door, and how he didn’t want to found any new religion, just wanted people to understand the Bible properly, haven’t we? Yep, didn't we all watch that poor-quality video about the life of Luther? If you were in rez, you saw it – maybe several times. (Didn't Luther make an appearance (I mean, wasn't he referred to) in PFAL? I really can't remember, don't care either.) Oh, how the bold VPW who only wanted to share the real truth of the gospel /sarc/ compared himself to that great man who stood firmly for God and against the corrupt church. Now I just today found out something else about Luther. Something that VPW never told us, nor was it pointed out in that film. But it does fit with something else that VPW and his coterie promoted. Extracted from Wikipedia The Jewish Virtual Library (a division of The American-Israeli Cooperative Enterprise) (whatever that might be) has the kindness to put his views in context for the period, but quotes some pretty nasty stuff: (Oh I wish you could read it in the original!) Jewish Virtual Library And what does the lovely VPW do? Pushes The Myth of the Six Million and tells us all those tales of murdered Jews were exaggerated and at most there were only a million. (Only!) (If there were only one person, it would be too many.) So…the MOGFODAT wasn’t so very different from that ancient bigot that he got us to equate himself with, then. Does anyone else here know this about Luther? And what about any of Luther's other views? I think I’m going to post this in Open because I’d rather it became a discussion about Martin Luther than VPW (but it’ll probably become that anyway)

Waysider, the article you linked contained this sentence: "Every employer has an anti- harassment policy to comply with laws." And of course some groups are specially protected. Yes, we have laws in the UK. Some better than others. Policies we must have. It's difficult to take a case to the Employment Tribunal, and stressful. Many prefer just to give up quietly and find other jobs, places to be. It always takes people standing up to bullies, people promoting a culture of decency, to ensure that rights, policies, procedures, anti-discrimination, etc are carried out properly. And bullies ... bully. Intimidate. Question is: do you assert your rights, or support those who are asserting their rights? Or do you turn the other way - "not notice" that it's happening - for fear of consequences to yourself? (FYI I've worked in several environments like this. It's really unpleasant. Made me very ill, in one place. But nothing you could actually put your finger on and say, it's unreasonable, as a single act. But cumulatively... I wussed out then, low level grumbling with all the other staff. But now? Maybe I'd deal with things differently. Or maybe not.)

I attend two churches and know of goings-on in several others. They ALL have child protection policies and appointed Child Safety Officers who I'm quite sure would treat any allegations of abuse very seriously. I am confident that complaints would be listened to and acted upon. ... I find that very reassuring - coming from TWI, you can see why. In addition, most business organisations seem to have such policies and in places I've worked, complaints are taken very seriously. Too seriously, sometimes. It befits all of us to be watchful of abuse of any kind and to see that action is taken to prevent it. You and me. All of us. If you see someone bullied in your workplace, what do you do? Like those janitors - turn a blind eye? Or report it and stand fast in the face of perhaps some abuse yourself? How confident do you feel about anti-abuse policies and procedures in your church, your workplace? If you're not happy about any procedures - or there isn't one - start working NOW to get better procedures and policies established. Otherwise, you're passively assenting to the abuse. Which makes you an abuser. The culture in your workplace - is partly about YOU in your workplace, your church, whatever. Help to make it a good one.

That many, huh, Waysider?

Eyesopen (I think it was) started a thread on this a couple of years ago. It went for a couple of pages. You might be able to find it - I can't - it was interesting and several people posted about remarkable incidents where they had broken down in the middle of intersections and strangers seemed to just arrive, push them out of the way, and when looked for afterwards - couldn't be found. And like incidents.

The trouble with TWI was/is, if you like - that there isn't enough socialism. It's all one-way. Sure people can walk through the way woods - but when it comes to genuine care of the individuals walking through the woods - it wasn't there. Like giving a decent wage; giving opportunity to flourish, develop one's abilities; respecting what the other(s) (the peons) could bring. Like being supportive when there was inability, illness, distress. Like working together for the common good, instead of for the good of the top guys. Never mind working together for the glory of God which is what the peons were told they were doing. "Animal Farm," anyone? Sounds to me like some of you are confusing socialism with communism, which it certainly isn't. But if we start talking about that, this thread will get banished to the now defunct politics forum and we shall all be lined up against a wall and shot by the moderators.