anotherDan

cynic... you read my post I see.... that's all you have to say?

waysider.... LOL! "seek that ye may excel to the edifying of your partner."

You know I am, Eyes, you sweet little adorable fragile and fragrent, adorable one!

dear readers, please note: Sky and I are posting at the same time... his compliment of my earlier post may not have included the most recent! :) Also note: these two people are going to share the same inheritance.

Yes, Abi, but I was trying to say (badly, I'm afraid) that for me, a lot of these doctrinal issues have to take a back seat to the cross. It's like cynic's tirade, above. Sky pushed his button, doctrinally. He probably skipped right over the heart Sky has shown in his posts. You, however, did not. You responded to his actual heart. I'm far more in ageement with cynic's doctrinal position than Sky's, but I love Sky's heart, and I loved to read the interaction between you and him and Wrds. There is some great stuff going on here. Another might rightly say that cynic is giving Sky what he deserves. I think Sky's view of Calvinism is perfunctory (is that a word? I mean somewhat superficial) and at times unfair. Wrds in particular, and I have had some gentle nudges in that vein, but haven't missed some of the gems of Sky's heart, either. As far as new threads, I have the spot survey which still has LOTS to explore. (Can't wait for TBones' second installment) and I've been cooking a very detailed discussion on "the gift of holy spirit" which I'm planning on reviving the Speaking in Tongues thread... it will not be what you may be thinking... I think you'll enjoy that one. So what did you think of Sir Buzzard? Did you catch his "debate" with the muslim on YouTube? Cynic, you have zeal, and I empathize with the position of God's soverignity, as I hope my earlier posts show. I used to debate on another forum... sometimes for weeks AGAINST Calvinists, but I'm reforming! And far less into debating, I might add. It's all well and good to "contend for the faith that was once delivered to the saints," it's likewise good to not only do as Jesus did, but as he said we should. That's where I really got off base in TWI... somehow, with "Christ in me," I was supposed to gun down all the Pharisees, like Jesus did, and yeah, that can be done at times perfectly within the will of God. It NEEDS to be done. But in later years I have gained a much deeper respect for God and Jesus, and I often leave their enemies and even mine to them (to God, and to Jesus Christ, who will judge the quick and the dead.) This has opened the door for me to share deeply with a variety of people that I formerly, to my shame, despised as inferior in learning or morals or whatever. Sky, you do a disservice to Spurgeon when you say he didn't fully agree with Calvinism. Spurgeon was the BEST kind of Calvinist. When you quoted him, it was against the "ultra-whatevers..." people who take it too far to see the responsibility God requires of man... just the thing you're talking about. (And that was the point of your post, I realize that, but again, if you want to see what Calvinism looks like in action, take a look at Spurgeon.) And look up the definition of gregarious. I think you might mean egregious. Gregarious means friendly. When you look it up, you'll see this picture there: edited to say: but you've got to go to bed... 6am comes soon!

bulwinkl, that's it, man! (wow... now that's FRO, bro!) great harmonies, comping and guitars... quite a performance!

:wub: love you, rainbowgirl! ================================================================================ ===================== That's how I picture Eyes and Dooj.... up there with bulwinkl.... I hear there's going to reduce him to mousse or something. Don't let those smiling faces fool you, bul! ;)

I concede the point, cman, by Moses came the Law; grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. These are two other intersecting lines I cannot weld on my earthly anvil. This I can grasp by grace: Let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, looking unto Jesus, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame... ...he became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross...

What a delightful thought, you dear, sweet, fragile little thing. I adore you!

Marvelous discussion, and too much to comment on... you guys have really been posting up a storm, and I'm delighted in all of you. Partly, I must admit, I'm over my head. I'm tackling some doctrinal issues that are more basic than predestination/free-will, election/decision. Once someone quoted Spurgeon, I felt in myself, "yes," I can go with that, at least for now. Of course the discussion has veered in a good way to encompass other vital interests in our lives, and again, I'm so delighted to see the discussion being fruitful in various ways. I would like to comment on one of the things that cman said about Jesus, who he said, "was never held to a doctrine" and "letting yourselves die" (as he did), "the doctrines being put out of the way." I do not see Jesus not being held to a doctrine. He confronted those who taught as doctrine the commandments of men, but held to the commandment of God (John 15:1ff) and he didn't come to destroy the Law, but to establish it. I have two books on my shelf with the same exact title, The Gospel According to Jesus. One is by John MacArthur, the other by a zen guy (can't think of his name) who shows throughout the NT how Jesus was in tune with all the great voices of God throughout the eons. One is left and the other is right. The Jesus I see is not somewhere in the middle, but transcends both their paradigms of him. Jesus Christ is the key to all of this. One good look at the cross, and so many things fade into insignificance. As the heart begins to comprehend the onlybegotten Son of God, His beloved Son, giving up all his glory, all his rights, his very life "for the joy that was set before him," suddenly even God Himself-- His ways and His love, are brought home to us. Jesus was the Word itself, the doctrine and the Law and quite surely the songs of Israel, the Psalms. This may be akin to what cman was saying, but I didn't read it that way. Where I think these great issues come to have meaning is where Spurgeon so often dwelt, at the foot of the cross. Those were my nails that held him to the cross, that was my crown of thorns upon his head. Those were my stripes laid upon his back. He turned not his face from spitting and contempt. He was despised of men and they concluded that God hated him. They mocked him in his pain and reveled in their hearts about their "victory" over him, but they never did really take his life, he was giving it freely for them -- even them! And even me. "Father, forgive them...." I cannot hammer out the intersection of Spurgeon's "two lines," but I can see Jesus, where those two lines crossed, where both the goodness and severity of God intersected at the crossroads of all time. Yes, sky, JUST LIKE YOU, he did not have a chance in hell that he would be remembered... but he had a chance in heaven. His funeral was very poorly attended, though a few loved him immensely. Just a few? But he had fed THOUSANDS! There were times when crowds of people followed him "and he healed THEM ALL." Josephus took little note, Caesar took little note, but his followers became filled with the spirit that he promised them -- "I will not leave you comfortless; I will come to you." Christ himself was raised from the dead, and lives today for one reason only, he was subject unto God. He did not put away doctrine; far from it. He was the doctrine in blood red, black and blue, and all the colors of the rainbow.

funny, Bump!Eyes, Dooj, Belle, take note!

perfect!

it does now, "Mike" would say otherwise

bulwinkl, it's all your fault! One, cut a hole in a box.... LOL

A pineapple pizza will be delivered to your door. We're trying to arrange for the young Moin ich hand to deliver it personally, but nothing's been decided permanently.

I know you're out there, 'cause I can hear you breathin' :drumhit:

((((((( tracy )))))))))) I'm praying for it right now. Hope your car windows are rolled up!

<---- clueless

LOL

bulwinkl, interesting reply. thanks for sharing that. I got a hinky (don't ask, 'cause I don't know either) feeling once at a meeting where LCM taught, and I was thinking, "I'm glad I didn't bring anybody to this meeting." wrds, I wonder if St. Paul could see us today. Would he object if we microwaved his words and said, "My little children, in whom I travail in birth again until Christ be reformed in you."?

you have to bring candy for everyone when you return I know you know how, since I slipped through security and took a look at your testing123 over in area 51 edit: it's only a "spot survey" because I'm surveying greasespots. They're really not greasespots, of course, but most don't seem to mind the moniker. Don't want to put anyone on the spot. If you're taking your time so you can answer well, who could argue with that? BTW, I have to admit that I doubt the authenticity of the above story. It just doesn't seem right to me that God would write in ALL CAPS. But what do I know?

You Aar indeed. Especially you.Raf... we're posting at the same time... edited to include: OMG, you are so right, and so funny! Candidate for "GreaseSpotGems". OMG OMG, I'm dying!

Abi, to quote my favorite "Master and Commander," "What a fascinating modern age we live in." (I highly recommend the movie.) We have to take what we can get. The body of Christ now exists on the Internet, though some are never here. Talk about resurrection. Talk about "the living Christ" ! come on, T-Bone. I know you're out there. Share.

Wow, squirrel! You were right there with the perfect photo! LOL I was going to put a PS, but since you granted me grace against a double post.... I want to go on record that I've become extremely fond of Oldiesman, Dooj, EyesOpen, and rascal. (I adored Abigail from the first moment I met her! And T-Bone and Socks? Who couldn't love them?) edited to say... and who could not love George Aar?