Stayed Too Long

I absolutley refuse to buy anything for my 18 year old daughter.....too small, wrong color, last years style, only a geek would wear that Dad, etc, etc, etc. She thinks it is pretty cool to have a glass of wine once in awile, so I bought three single servering bottle of different wines, and wrapped a $50 bill around each one. As expected she shakes the presents all the time trying to figure out what they are. One of them apparently is not wrapped very tight because she can hear the liquid when she shakes the package. She can't imagine what it is, probably hoping it isn't some cheap perfume or a bottle of shampoo.

Abigail: ________________________________________________ I think, sometimes, we women assume that the man in our life should be like the leading men in romantic movies - - able to read our minds, always ready to offer the emotional and physical, but nonsexual support we need. In reality, they can't read our minds any more than we can read theirs. So, we have to clearly and specifically tell them what we want. ________________________________________________ AMEN!! AND AMEN!! Ohhhhhh, the problems that could be avoided if woman would only TELL USwhat they wanted! Of course it would be the man's responsibility to respond in an appropriate manner once the woman's needs are made known to him.

I am 57 and my sexual appetite has not gone down much. There are two buddies I grew up with from childhood and they are usually looking 'for a good time'. There a two guys I work with who say that are not that much interest in sex anymore. To be honest, 'feelings' and 'being in the right mood' have very little bearing with most men I know. Prior to marrying I dated very little so after my divorce I decided to date and educate myself about woman, in the event marrying ever entered into the picture again. Then I would have a better understanding of myself and what I was looking for in a mate. Over a period of 8 years and after dating 20 woman or so, some longer than others, I have found woman differ as much as men in their sexual appetites. Some show little desire and mainly engage in love making because I wanted to. It was a matter of 'let's get it over with', and I found this quite unfulfilling. There are those who have sexual desires and enjoy making love. After it is over they don't want much attention in that area until the next urge comes along. Some want sex for the love of sex. They are ready on a moments notice and not afaid to let you know it. These woman will tell and show you exactly what they like and dislike. Two people have to be honest and determine where their interests fall. Like any area of a relationship a couple can work together and determine a middle ground. When heads butt and lines are drawn is when problems begin.

Belle: ________________________________________________ What about - you reap what you sow? ________________________________________________ I believe whole heartily with this concept. My postings have to do with the possibility that VPW repented before he died. If you believe in prophecy and that Mal George is a prophet, his prophecy seems to indicate repentence. I can not imagine God being pleased with him if he did not repent. If you reject Mal George as a prophet, or if you question the prophecy he gave, then you may or may not believe Wierwille repented.

Garth as I stated at least three times because of your unbelief in prophecy, you are not going to believe in the prophecy of Mal George. To me that should end the discussion. You have every right to disagree with me and I respect that right. I have, by the same token, every right to disagree with you. We don't agree so let in go.

Garth: ________________________________________________ Any other questions? ________________________________________________ And you are whom? The final authority? The Vicar? The MOG of Greasespot? The source from whom all knowledge and truth eminates? Hey nobody said you had to believe anything so what is your problem? Maybe your thong is riding up a little high today? You don't believe in prophecy or that Mal George is a prophet----GREAT!! (you can fast forward to the next forum). I was speaking to those who do. If someone believes in prophecy and that Mal George is a prophet (again I know this does not apply to you Garth), then they have to consider his prophecy at VPW's funeral when evaluating whether he will be receiving rewards at the bema. If I told my son I was well pleased with him, you can bet I would not be holding much back from him. How does anyone know if a prophet's message is 'right on' or 'god breathed'? First you have to believe in prophecy and prophets (which I know does not apply to you Garth). But if someone does, they will have developed some kind of system to evaluate the authenticity of the messager an their message. If after consideration they believe Mal George is an authentic prophet who speaks for God, his message has to pack some weight in this matter. We read what horrible things Paul, David, and others in the bible did and hold them up as examples of God's forgiveness. We preach that if God can forgive all the rotten things they did, surely he will forgive you and me our mistakes.. We then feel a great burden lifted from ourselves because we know God has forgiven us. Well doesn't Wierwille, the board of trustees, and anyone else in TWI who has wronged us deserve the same forgiveness? What if it was you or I in TWI who were the evil doers? I'm sure there must be a few in here who were part of the problem? As a twig coordinator I came down pretty hard on some folks because they were hanging out with unbelievers, and told them to seperate themselves from their friends. They told me to "shove it" and left, cursing the day we had met. Should God forgive me? Or should they be looking forward to the day when God will unleash his mighty arm and punish me? Shouldn't I be able to look to God's forgiveness also? The Pope has spoken openly about forgiving his would be killer. I saw a woman on tv plead for the life of her son's killer because she had forgiven him. Have they ascended to a level some of us (myself included) have not yet risen to? Or are they wrong and it should be "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth"? Or somewhere in between? I really don't know the answer to this question of forgiveness, but don't see how God can discriminate in passing it out, by making it conditional upon someone else looking forward to that person be judged. I certainly hope God is not going to punish me because someone I have wronged, is looking forward to the day, as Kit Sober is, of "Gehazi received his judgment, as I hope to see vpw receive his".

Spreewell Suspended For Sexual Vulgarity It just seems to get better and better!!

woooopsss wrong forum.....sorry

Bush Certified Winner in Ohio Why you are at it get a life!!

GarthP: ________________________________________________ Now why would a just god reward someone like VPW with more rewards and all, even given the deliberate abuses that VPW heaped upon people with such callousness? ________________________________________________ You or I have no idea if or when VPW repented. If he did, we don't know what he did with his life afterwards for God. Maybe he was a model Christian. I don't know what your belief on prophecy is, or your opinion of Rev Mal George as a prophet, but at VPW's funeral as he prophesied, he said "This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased". If you don't believe in prophecy or that Rev George is a prophet then you will discard the above and maybe not expect much for VPW at judgment time. If you do believe in prophecy and Rev Mal George as a prophet, you have to give it some consideration when wondering if VPW will be have some rewards coning at the bema.

My point is, if some people are wronged by another, they look to the future judgement for those wrongs to be made right. They believe God will punish those who have harmed them or their loved ones when time is over, and then all will be okay. Like looking forward to the future with vegence and revenge. This belief seems to bring a sense of calming or satisfaction to the hurt party. Oldiesman I am referring to Kit Sober's statement: ________________________________________________ "Gehazi received his judgment, as I hope to see vpw receive his". ________________________________________________ To me this indicates she is looking forward to a time when VPW will be judged and she will be present. Or at least have knowledge of the judging. She is looking forward now to that time in the future, she is anticipating it. What if the person who did the wrong (VPW in this case) had asked God for forgiveness and received it, will the wronged person be disappointed because God has not meted out punishment?

Quote: ________________________________________________ Kit: Gehazi received his judgment, as I hope to see vpw receive his ________________________________________________ Revenge, or at least some kind of 'Godly Punishment' in the future, seems to be a big part of some Christian's attitude. What if VPW actually was sorry for the wrongs he had committed before he died, and God forgave him, like the bible says He will? What if, when it comes time for the judgments to be meted out, and VPW and any other evil doers who have repented, don't get hell fire, 50 lashes, or their hands slapped, will you be disappointed? What if God gives them a slap on the back and says "good job my good and faithful servant, come on it". What if someone you thought their rewards should have been taken away for all the evil they had done, actually end up with more rewards or a higher position than you? Will you rebel against God, or rejoice and celebrate their life and be content?

Had a very good time at my division party. We rented 4 lanes at the bowling alley and everyone seemed to enjoy throwing a ball at mostly regulation pins with a few colored ones tossed in to possibly win a prize. We had a side pot with everyone throwing in a dollar. For every stike you threw, you drew 2 playing cards, and for every spare you drew 1. After the 10th frame the person with the highest poker hand won the pot (I had a jack high staight, but was beat by a queen high :D-->). The bosses had an open tab at the bar for about an hour so that was nice too. Plenty of horses-doovers to snack on also.

I think my choice would have to be John Townsend. He worked hard at making himself a VP clone. He always seemed to use the same phrases and tone of voice as The Teacher.

HEY--I resemble some of these remarks!!

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and how about baseball and homeruns?

Think of the terrific snow skiing in all those craters!

There are around 750 people who work for the company I am employeed, and are located in four different locations around the city. We have a huge company breakfast, and then each division has its own smaller get togethers sometime during the season. In the summer there are similar picnics. It do attend most of my division parties because it is nice visiting with the families of my fellow employees. It is enjoyable seeing how much their kids have grown, what school events they are involved with, and what kinds of promotions or trouble their spouses have managed to get themselves into. I have attended some of the company parties but since I know relatively few of the employees there, it is not so comfortable mingly around. I usually end up just hanging out with my division employees.

GarthP quote: ________________________________________________ And would that be any worse than those who would not bring up the challenge, usually for the reasons noted above? Perhaps it could be said of them that they 'stayed too long', ... ya think? ________________________________________________ I am not arguing they should not be challenged....on the contrary they should be! Plagurism, using people, ruining lives, etc should be exposed. Those are some of the reasons I hang out here. Hopefully I can help others that it also has happened to. My point in this matter is we hold some to different standards than others. If we liked one person for some reason, like the person loved us, was of assistance us, or we thought they were one hell of a person and really cool, we will cut them some slack in their acceptance of VPW, et al. Praises will abound and the person's life presented as that of a wonderul human being. On the other hand if someone comes in here that we do not know, and if that person supports VPW, et al,......well suffice it so say they had better be pretty thick skinned. And I think it is just human nature to do this. Many of our decisions are really quite subjective. Bill Clinton goes into Kosovo, the Republican's oppose him, and the Democrats back him. George H Bush goes into Kuwait, the Democrats oppose him, and the Republicans back him.

It has been my observation that many at GSC have two standards when it comes to holding people accountable while they were a part of TWI. It pretty much depends on who they were and if they were perceived as "loving", "a wonderful person", "loved God", "just helped me so much", or similar attributes. Most folks here at the cafe believe VPW stole much of what he taught in PFAL from others, used his position to intimidate others, and was a sexual preditor. It would be hard to get many here to argue these points. In fact most have condemned the current trustees for covering up VP's and LCM's similiar activities. They also point out and hold accountable other leadership who knew what was going on by either aiding, covereding up, or ignoring the facts and turning a blind eye. Yet it is inconceivable to me the original trustees and their wive's did not know what VPW was doing in the motor coach with all those woman. But they are spoken of here with fond tenderness. Most of the time posters use terms of endearmont to describe their relationship with them. A cover up is a cover up no matter if we think well of the person or not. In the same vain, anyone who today expressed at GSC the same view of VPW as Mark apparently has, would be rousted out and challenged...just ask Mike. In another thread recently the author was questioning how anyone today could stay and support TWI with all that has been exposed about it in recent years. I think it is probably human nature to cut some people slack and not others. An extreme example is Jesse James and Bonnie and Clyde. All three were cold blooded murderers yet we have elevated them to legendary mythical status. On the other hand the only thing elevated with Scott Peterson is people's hatred of him.

Although I did not know him personally his work with Way Productions always impressed me very much. He will be missed.

You have my true sympathy.......I also am a survivor. How young girls can find so much to giggle about at 3am is still a mystery to me!!

mj412 sorry for my sloppy writing style. I will work to improve it in the future. To answer your question: No, I do not agree with you and herbiejuan.

mj412 "the criminals in the post office are wanted criminals . these are guys who have done there time and have moved into the neighborhood and are trying to live a "normal" life with their records and details of the crime and their current adress displayed. I think it is a little different ." I was using pictures of criminals in the post office to counter what herbiejuan had learned in his abnormal psych class. "I think posting pics lulls folks into a false sense of security. Many times (as evidenced by the ongoing RC scandel) child molesters remain undiscovered, sometimes for their whole lives. Often times these people seek out and hold positions that place them in close contact with children (teachers, ministers, rec dept employees) and use their authority and implied power to silence or shame their victims. So to think that those three men (or women) are the only perps in the neighborhood is delusional." I totally disagree with it especially the last sentence. Just because someones picture is posted we are not going to be lulled into a false sense of security and let all other common sense go out the window (go Shellon). And especially to conclude we think they are the only perps in the neighborhood is delusional on their part. And keep in mind that CHILD MOLESTERS CAN NOT BE CURED!! They are not like a thief or bad check writer who gets out and can go straight.