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Lifted Up

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Everything posted by Lifted Up

  1. Certainly Kristen Skedgell wrote of this regarding her case. I was never told to keep my assault in the lockbox; I suppose they figured nobody would believe a male survivor. But the term "loosened up" was used about me.
  2. Perhaps the best post on this thread. Short and right to the point!
  3. No argument, But the truth of this sexual activity in the Way is even stronger. Abusers in all walks of life crave power over their victims. As my best survivor friend, who is an entertainer told me, they all read from the same script. And that power is not always physical. Mind control in the Way was rampant. This puts much of the activity into the rape and sexual assault categories. It also explains how I, a male, was sexually assaulted by two corps women. They even used the same words VPW used, that I needed to be loosened up. As you would say, this doesn't make adultery and fornication Godly even if they are done consensually to both parties. But such spiritual pressure does not pass for consent. Such is the fruit of the great "promise". Ask any Way survivor.
  4. Yea, I hear you. They have to push this story in an attempt to lend validity to their teachings. I was from the old days when VPW was still alive and leading he Way. They cant let their teachings stand on their own merit now as they couldn't then either. (I was 8th corps) My personal question is, did the Word as it had not been known since the first century include VPW's teaching to LCM and the corps than the "men of God" had the right to have their sexual needs met in order to further the work of the ministry? Many women were exually assaulted for this purpose, was THAT the reason for God speaking to VPW? And some corps men who did not go along...including this one...were sexually assaulted by equally mind controlled corps women to show us how to claim our "Godly" rights. Was that part of "the promise"? I hope you got out without suffering much trauma.
  5. Ive heard a lot about promoting lies and false rumors lately. But I don't know if anybody got my point. I'll try it another way. Let's assume, for the proverbial sake of argument, that VPW told the truth about what he described. My point was, then why tell the world? If the word God was teaching him to teach others was that great, why does it need embellishing? I actually wanted to speak to those who believe it happened. I would say that even if it did, all VPW did by telling this story was make a Muhammed Ali like claim "I am the greatest" instead of letting his teachings stand for themselves
  6. To me, the premise of this thread has long been irrelevant. I have never worried about the snowstorm since I was woken up a decade and a half ago. Weather reports don't cover everything. In fact, I was out running once at HQ and ran across what seemed to be a very localized snow squall. It started suddenly, was blinding for less than five minutes, then stopped just as suddenly. I'm sure there was no weather station around that would have reported it. But if God told to VPW as VPW said, why use it to boost his own glory instead of just said teaching speak for itself? What does speak for itself to e are all the sexual assaults and associated VPW "doctrine" that laid the foundation for them. That of course includes but is not limited to my own assault. If those are the fruits of God speaking directly to VPW, I wouldnt want any more of them.
  7. Were we Way Corps men as leaders entitled to all the women in the kingdom? If we were, and refused to claim what was ours, maybe that was why some of us had to be "Loosened up". (The exact words used not only by VPW, about LCM, but by my two assaulters about me)..
  8. Waydale then Greasespot kept hammering reality about the Way at me until I was finally ripe for a trigger to stir reality in my mind, and y own memory. Full of resentment from being yanked involuntarily out of the Way, I simply refused to believe the bad things that I was hearing about....namely the sexual assaults then rapes. Finally the trigger came, in the form of "Losing the Way", written by a person I had been with in the Way Corps, even in the same state during my apprentice year. Empathizing with her and many who were subjected to rape and sexual assault, I finally believed them, Kristen's book striking so many bells and raising red flags like crazy in front of my face. All that, and help from a non Way related survivor friend, brught back the memory of my own sexual assault. So though it didn't bear fruit with me right away, Waydale, followed by Greasespot, laid the groundwork for recalling my trauma, for which I have been undergoing therapy since 2017. .
  9. My best survivor friend understood that idea, despite having little knowledge of TWI or any cults. She is a child abuse survivor who helped start a large national group to fight abuse. She suggested to me that a book written specifically for male child abuse survivors might help me heal from my Way sexual assault (at 29). She was right. This was after she helped me fully recall everything and break my silence. Her help sort of culminated my waking up that probably started with Kristen Skedgell's "Losing the Way". Didn't end my healing; still working on that.
  10. Yes, and it was those times, while he was trying to show us his "loving father" self, that I think was supposed to keep us in obedience when we had to endure his not so fatherly wrath.
  11. Thanks for not simply giving your answer, but adding your own reasons. You take the "Edge" off of any doubts I had in saying that!. It took me 38 years to fullly eliminate my blindness and see that, thanks partly to my above mentioned friend. For decades I refused to believe anyone had been sexually assaulted, let alone myself.
  12. Nice to hear your perspectives as one who knew the guy in the corps. And I hope your recovery continues to go well; mine is doing OK, my sexual assault was not my only trauma. Interestingly, the friend who has been most helpful in my recovery has no Way or cult connections, but is a child abuse survivor. But she understands how it goes in a cult; in many ways we were treated as children. I just started a new therapist, there was nothing wrong with my other one, but we agreed it is time for me to explore new avenues.
  13. I think you gave some good reasons why your book is still going strong. One reason is that cult trauma, like any trauma, is lifelong. We old folks are still being affected, and I think others find the book relevant because cults and abusers, no matter how different from each other, use so many common techniques, so today's cult survivors find it relevant. Do you feel that in many ways we were treated as children in the Way? My best survivor friend is not Way or cult related, but a child abuse survivor who helped start a large national group to fight abuse. A few years ago she suggested a book written by Mike Lew for child abuse survivors to help in my recovery from my Way sexual assault, even though she knew it happened to me as an adult. She understood; it's amazing how much she knows. And I have found the relevance myself in my support group interactions with survivors of church and other child abuse.
  14. The only time I heard the subject mentioned (I was yanked out at the end of 1979 soon after my sexual assault) was at ROA 1978 when VPW called the corps going WOW into the woods for a chat. He basically advised us to watch ourselves sexually, as he has already had to pay for several abortions, claiming he didn't like abortions. But I never heard him utter anything else on the subject. He sure sounded like it was more of a matter of inconvenience than anything else.
  15. Unruhka, I dont get into these forums much, as I did years ago. I still can't believe you made this post almost a year ago before I noticed it. I know about flashbacks. Not just my own but from several survivor friends. My best survivor friend, the one who helped me break my silence in 2017 (about my 1979 assault). was raped repeatedly by her older brother, also decades ago. In the long process of her recovery, she eventually co-founded a national child abuse fighting organization, and knows a lot. She knew, for exakmple, that despite my assault taking place at age 29, the effects of this cult, even though she has no cult background, were as if it had been child abuse, and she correctly recommended a book accordingly. She also has great knowledge about special problems faced by male survivors. And there are LOTS of people in the group she helped start also fighting child abuse. Then in addition to her personal kelp, she also gives me lots of the most critical medicine...laughs and smiles, for she is also my favorite entertainer. IShe can give me that gift in the present...I just watched her entertain a couple hours ago...or from the past, in a role she is very well known for that she had...well, bck in the 70s when she ws being abuse. And I have some other wonderful survivor friends who suffered their hurts as children.Geez, it has been almost a year since you made this post. I hope you are doing well.
  16. Good question. I don't think we had any "playing around" in Philly, but we only had one family like that out of seven, plus one family of two married couples. My sexual assault ("loosening up") was to wait til the fall after that year when I was at HQ.
  17. Agreed; that is why I said it, it is what some others try to communicate to me.
  18. Grace, your heart is so beautiful. I was sexually assaulted in the Corps in 1979 by peers. I was being "loosened up" as per VPW "doctrine", and I know that was it because I overheard those exact words used about me. I only fully recalled my assault in 2017, thanks to my survivor friend who is amazing. I think of her when I read your post because she suffered repeated sexual abuse as a child from her older brother long ago. But she is also doing well, having helped co found a national child àbuse fighting group. And she knows lots about the subject: her compassion and knowledge of problems façed by us male survivors is what helped me. But perhaps even more importantly, despite never being in a cult, she knows we were in many ways treated as children. She recommended a book by Mike Lew for male child abuse survivors despite knowing my assault happened as an adult. When I told her the book was helping me, she replied that she knew it would. She also gives me a very vital medicine for recovery: laughter. You have probably seen her sometimes on tv.
  19. Oh, no argument. Of course it wasn't written down as official, which would be admitting to the actual practice. No more than my friend's brother would admit to what he thought was his right to abuse her. And no more than VPW would officially admit to what he thought was his right to rape and/or assault so many women. But verbally he sure promoted the idea of Way leaders being entitled to have their sexual needs met. And for many, even some women, there was a duty and even willingness to act according to what our MOGFOT said and did. I was not immune to that idea of course, in many ways discarding my own personal values to obeying what I thought was God's will as spoken by our leader. But that assault was so strongly against my values that I froze in a very confusedand ashamed state, until the fear of an even greater shame prompted me to escape to my bunk on the men's side of the trailer and freeze there. As it turned out, the shame was enhanced again when some of the others arrived in the dark, not knowing I was there in my upper bunk, and unknowingly revealed to me all that the two women had told them about their "playing around", and, yes, they specifically used the words "loosened up" about me. I could give even more details. BTW, as a side factor, IMO we in many ways were treated as children in the corps, even though we were supposed to be adult leaders. That is why my non Way friend, who helped me break my silence, knew to suggest a book written (by Mike Lew) for male child abuse survivors, despite knowing my assault happened as an adult. But she co-founded a national organization to fight child abuse and knows a lot on the subject. Oh yeah, I wil give one more detail here; the two women who assaulted me were alone on their side; as most or all of the others were away on LEAD at the time. Again, you are right, loosening up was not official doctrine (maybe effective doctrine from the practrive) as that would have been admitting to, among other things, VPW's abuse and promotion thereof among his followers.
  20. Healing IS possible, but a sexual assault victim never "gets over it". I haven't. Sad.
  21. I guess at the time of my HQ assault in 1979, which was not too long after Rome City was acquired, the "loosening up" doctrine had been given to most of the corps, and I suppose staff that weren't corps. In "Undertow" Charlene Edge notes that when she learned that VPW had many women, and that many had been hurt, she notes that she also learned that there were women willing to go along with this doctrine. I figure that included helping to loosen up some of the men. I had not heard specifically about anybody, female or male, as young as you were being hurt, but it doesn't shock me. Yes, when something like that happens, it takes a long time to recognize all we went through, when, as was certainly the case with me, the idea that our leaders could do no wrong was so ingrained in my mind. And, cult or no cult, rape and other sexual assault can do terrible things inside one's mind, even if and while the victim does not consciously recall the event. My non Way (female) friend who helped me was repeatedly raped by her older brother, even while she was filming the TV show in which she was a child actor. In later years, when she reached a slack time in her life, the prior abuse hit her hard. She is doing well now and thus was able to help me, but no one ever "gets over it". Something else...people all around may have a terribly erroneous conception that males cannot be hurt by sex. This attitude was extra cruel in the Way. My main assaulter still thinks it was all just a game, playing around, and I think STILL has no conception how much she hurt me. You would think that people would understand better the hurting of someone in the 7th grade, with with old Way attitudes still in place in many people, I'm not so sure. I commend you for your courage in speaking up.
  22. "Loosening up" was a doctrine reflecting VPW's preaching that the man of God should have his sexual needs fulfilled so he could do the work of the ministry. That filtered down to me when I was sexually assaulted at HQ in 1979. Yes, it was just a game to my two female assaulters, and had I gone along with this "game' no doubt all would have been well. After I slinked away and froze in my upper bunk...after lights out...the rest of the guys came in the room bit by bit. Of course, lights out in the corps meant.....just that, so they started talking about me, because the two women (the others on the women's side were away on LEAD) had told the guys all about their "game" and how they had enjoyed it. I didn't, contrary to what I was supposed to feel, but the talk centered on how it was good that I got "loosened up". The guys soon went off to sleep, never realizing I was there all the time. It took me 38 years to fully wake up and break my silence, though the process started back in 2008 with the publication of "Losing the Way" It was actually a non Way/cult person who was a child abuse survivor who helped me fully remember in 2017 . The effects of VPW's sexual doctrines had far reaching effects, as many know, but, yes, there were some males affected too....at least one anyway. And of course Martindale sure did "loosen up".
  23. 40 years and three months ago was my sexual assault at HQ.
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