Camp Gunnison's Accreditation

[OldSkool]

Well I did a little snooping around the interweb today. When I was in the way international I was told numerous times that the in-residence way corps program is accredited. Seems like they embellished their story quite a bit. Follow along below.

Here is a link showing that the way international is accredited in Colorado. They are listed as Camp Gunnison, Inc.

However, here's the comical portion of the accreditation.

Religious Authorization - A bona fide religious postsecondary educational institution which is exempt from property taxation under the laws of this state and whose degrees or diplomas have no state recognition.

Follow the link

http://highered.colorado.gov/Academics/Colleges/privateaccredited.asp

I posted this earlier and wanted to repost it in this context.

The way international keeps some form of operating license / accreditation with the state of Colorado, where requirements are VERY lax. They make the students take the way of abundance class series multiple times throughout the year in order to meet minimum hours requirements required by the state. They cannot function solely out of the state of Ohio because the standards are way higher than Colorado. With Universities like Ohio State, and University of Cincinnati there is a lot of sunshine on any type of college operating in Ohio. So what does the way international do? They keep their "college" based out of Colorado and have the students living in Ohio where the in-residence way corps currently are training. They keep appearances, so to speak, by doing just enough out of Gunnison to keep the state happy. Lead for example.

In other words they are doing a shell game on the states of Colorado and Ohio. Their college is not legitimate. They do think they are exempt from that and a lot more.

[chockfull]

Apparantly they just do this so that they don't have to pay property taxes on Camp Gunnison.

Hmmmm.

Now that they do not have the actual program on the campus, I wonder if the state of Colorado was aware of that if they would try to reinstate collecting property taxes on Gunnison. I'm sure in this economy that there are so many state programs suffering that they may really want to collect those taxes.

:excl:

[OldSkool]

Now that they do not have the actual program on the campus, I wonder if the state of Colorado was aware of that if they would try to reinstate collecting property taxes on Gunnison. I'm sure in this economy that there are so many state programs suffering that they may really want to collect those taxes.

:excl:

That occurred to me as well. Obviously they are pushing the envelope? Perhaps someone would care to make some phone calls?

Also, I love this line from CO site:

and whose degrees or diplomas have no state recognition.

Obviously, if the issuing institution state does not recognize the diploma then it's worthless everywhere. Reciprocity being what it is and all.

But I thought I would bring this to light since the way international calls themselves accredited and say that they have degree granting status. And verily they do. Only, what they issue is totally worthless and they neglect to tell people that on the way corps application.

Liars.

[OldSkool]

Mmm...I wonder if Ohio is interested to learn there is a school accredited in Colorado running operations in it's borders?

Or perhaps none of it matters.?

[Ham]

Perhaps..

but then maybe they've taken the position let the buyer, or cult inductee beware..

[Twinky]

Maybe you can also check out what the requirements are in Indiana. When I was in rez, the "training" was notionally run from the Way Coll of Indiana (again, not Ohio) - something to do with not being able to get accreditation in OH.

Never occurred to me that the reason we sat through all those classes that we'd already done ??? number of times was simply to keep some sort of property tax exemption.

[Ham]

Now, claiming non-profit religious status.. as a bonafide(?) religious organization.. and running the "campus" like a resort.. might get somebody's attention..

[Twinky]

Okay, who's going to "shop" them?

Bet they manage to do just enough to keep it "legit". After all, don't they compel people to go to "fellowshop" or some teaching series whilst on grounds?

[Ham]

I dunno. Don't think so.. last I remember, they rented the place out..

maybe somebody who knows for sure can comment..

[OldSkool]

I dunno. Don't think so.. last I remember, they rented the place out..

maybe somebody who knows for sure can comment..

Last I knew they kept a ghost staff at Gunnison. When I was there department and Sunday morning fellowships were MANDATORY as was the STS hook up.

[Thomas Loy Bumgarner]

gee, shades of Pikes Peak Seminary. Maybe Colorado's State Board of Education needs to be investigated for such sloppiness over the years.

[HAPe4me]

I do not know for sure about them renting it out, but when I was up there last year, I was denied access. I talked to a few native gunnies when I was there, old friends, one of who is an exwayfer and they had not heard anything about it being available to anyone outside of TWI people for vacations or anything.

I think that rumor arose from a site which searched places to set up camping vacation rentals. They wrongly picked up Camp Gunnison from the word "Camp" in its name. Nobody in town that I know of has ever heard of any visitors who were not part of TWI,

I did verify that the properties (there are actually several different pieces) are all listed as tax exempt from property tax. The valuations seem low and outdated, but since they are exempt I assume the assessor really doesn't give a flip.

[Ham]

so that's it! Somebody (or web bot) mistakenly thought it was a place one would take one's family and camp!

[OldSkool]

so that's it! Somebody (or web bot) mistakenly thought it was a place one would take one's family and camp!

It always seemed like a prison camp with nice trappings when I was there as IRWC. Vacation spot? Ha!

[Ham]

sounds like you wouldn't describe it as a "religious center of higher learning" either..

[OldSkool]

sounds like you wouldn't describe it as a "religious center of higher learning" either..

Mmmm....no. Higher learning is laughable in this context. And they made so much over having degree granting status with the state of Colorado, only to learn that the degree isn't even recognized by the state that grants the status. More smoke and mirrors.

[Ham]

It seems to me.. they would be far better off as an organization, if they actually CONTRIBUTED something to society..

under vic I they had the "opportunity".

the R.C.'s. Well, they ended up tolerating a few rotten popes.. and had a few good ones..

but what kind of popes have been the twi experience?

vic I.. and he was horrid from the start.

vic II (ahem, martinjoke).. more oppressive and less godly than the pope before..

then pope rosie. They make fun of the R.C.'s for having some kind of female pope.. but what's the difference?

One of my kids went to a R.C. owned and operated private university..

they teach the kids chemistry, physics, mathematics, art.. english, history.. and theology.

in other words, they pay the price to BE gawd..

or try to.

If one wants to be gawd.. one had better BE gawd..

just a few thoughts..

[OldSkool]

they teach the kids chemistry, physics, mathematics, art.. english, history.. and theology.

Mmmm....those things are NOT taught by the way international.

[Ham]

Hmmm..

then da *mighty* state of Arizona might not care.. just give us the little incorporation fees along with some paper..

but what is it exactly that they actually DO teach?

[excathedra]

what a lucrative place

report 'em

[Ham]

what a lucrative place

report 'em

I really, really, reallly wish the report would make a difference..

well, it will someday.. I guess.

some of us were sent to observe..

Our observations aren't exactly worth ......

scary thouughts, but no..

If you think your report isn't worth a ......

think twice.

Please..

:)

[DogLover]

When I was there in-residence in early 1985, under T*m J's "reign of terror," some of us laughingly called it (with a nice Nazi accent), "the greatest Chrees-tian werk kamp in Amer-ica," playing on TWI's ad slogan of it being the greatest Christian camp in America. It was a hellhole of abuse with beautiful scenery.

Edited October 19, 2010 by DogLover

[OldSkool]

Hmmm..

but what is it exactly that they actually DO teach?

Subservience to Rosalie.

[bowtwi]

Wow. Just wow.

[HAPe4me]

Well, as for the Property Tax exempt thing it appears to be based on being a church residential property, not for being an an educational one. Here is the link to the County Assessors office records. If you can't open the link you can Google- Gunnison CO property records - and get there from that.

http://qpublic5.qpublic.net/co_gunnison_display.php?KEY=369900000025&account=R008876

Ownership is by: Way International, The

Parcel number (the main property): 3699-000-00-025

Account number: R008876

Mailing address: Legal Department, Box 328..... (yadayadayada)

I forgot last year was the year for reassessment of property values (done every 2 years in Colorado). The county now shows the 129 acre main property value at $ 5,622,640. That might be closer to correct than I thought, it is up $1,200,000 from 2007.