Right on everybody. It really is telling to me that when we all start thinking of that term in the Bible life - zoe - life in all of it's manifestations, why is it that more of that has started to open up to us once we stopped listening to the Pharisees?
I was going to start a new thread but when I saw this one, I thought it might fit here. I hope so, anyway.
A couple of weeks ago, I was in youtube looking at some video clips. To my surprise,
in the recommended clips list on the right side of the window.
Probably, I had previously looked for clips from dickedher (wierwille) or twi. Anyway, it was posted by a cult sycophant named Maurice Goulet.
I posted a comment and fortunately saved the comment to a separate file because it disappeared from youtube in less than 24 hours.
Here's what I wrote:
-----
My experience with Wierwille was first hand. He was a mean, nasty, narcissistic SOB.
He used and abused anyone he could, especially those of us gullible enough to enlist, as young adults, in the Way Corps (I was in the 9th).
He built a subculture based on the works of others (plagiarism). His "Way Tree" had accountability completely backward. Instead of, as was in the Book of Acts, the traveling ministers were accountable to the people who provided their sustinence, whenever Wierwille traveled, his minions were instructed to provide him with every comfort and luxury, but don't dare demand accountability from him. In other words, in his arrogance, he believed he did not have to answer to anyone. As a result, he used many of the young female WOWs and Way Corps for his personal toys in the 1970s and early 1980s. He holds a great deal of responsibility for what LC Martindale did that got him tossed aside by The Way. Wierwille both mentored Martindale and built the closed subculture of reckless abuse of women that Martindale got caught up in and perpetuated after Wierwille's death.
Martin Buber wrote (I and Thou) about the difference between people and things. Wierwille preached that people were to love and things were to be used. But he DID exactly the opposite in far too many instances.
I don't know that "mainstream media" even knows or cares who Wierwille was anymore, let alone believe anything about him. Having personally worked in corporate media, and now blogging regularly, I know that there is plenty of information online to document what Wierwille actually did.
Furthermore, his "foundational class" was FULL of irrational, non-logical and unsound arguments.
That class was nothing but indoctrination into a mindset where he set himself up to be the ONLY authority on what was the will of God.
His interpretation of Proverbs 29:18 is a poignant case in point.
There may be redeeming social value in a close examination of the history of The Way for understanding how people can be indoctrinated and change their behavior without basis in rational sound reasoning. But as far as I'm concerned, that's about it.
If you want to know the God of the Bible, you'll probably need to cast off a good bit of what you may have learned as a result of Wierwille's "ministry."
-----
I used Goulet's name on purpose. Maybe he'll think more about whether he wants to continue to bow down to dickedher's legacy if he knows that he can't completely disassociate his name from the legitimate criticism.
And Skyrider, I agree completely with your point about twi not providing room for people to grow up.
quite some time ago, i had posted -- the name of thread might be Hunt Close -- i don't know -- that as a newlywed i asked wierwille what he could suggest regarding my learning how to raise a child/children
he recommended a dog book called "Hunt Close" which I bought lol expecting some heavy spiritual insight
Be miserable because you have to "witness" all the time or feel guilty if you don't. Recruit recruit so you can bring in other people to be miserable like you. Yeah that works.
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waysider
They were stuck in idle for a long time. Then they just stalled out. Now the battery is dead and the jumper cables are nowhere to be found.
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skyrider
Yeah......like that rust-bucket, oil-dripping wow-mobile at the roa. Stuck in the mud.
Those of us with our four-wheel drive jeeps and suv's are NOT AROUND ANYMORE to pull them out.
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skyrider
When you're 18 or so.....recruitment seems like "involvement." Being young and given the responsibility
to go out there and "win others" seems to have merit.
But twi-recruitment is more like being a pawn. Twi wants to use YOU to find and recruit others for twi-servitude.
You know, it would be quite another thing IF there was a godly purpose in it.....like worship God, follow His
dictates, live love, do Christian service, etc. etc. But no.....twi has a twisted, deceiving agenda.
Ever notice where twi REALLY STANDS on marriage, children, etc? If anything come between you and recruiting
others, then twi recommends divorce. If children slow you down from "moving the verd" then maybe you'd be
better to not have any. Oh, the message is subtle. Twi doesn't want to be pegged as anti-family....but it is.
Recruitment.....is first gear.
Where are those highly-professional 48 year olds in twi......who are business ceo's or skilled professionals?
Or, those with large families......4, 5 or 6 kids and are given the opportunity TO TEACH SEVERAL SUNDAY NIGHT
TEACHINGS to witness God's blessing of big families? Yeah...that's right. Those types are absent from the
scene. Instead you get old, dried-up, divorced "teachers" who instruct you about life and living......ppffft.
Twi has NEVER taught 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th gear.
They don't know what it is.
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WordWolf
twi- and its offshoots- are a lot like a bad, mid-life crisis.
A man thinks of his glory days as college and a few years after college.
He was popular, a jock, in shape, and handsome.
So, now, he keeps trying to re-capture a handful of years from his early 20s
into his 50s, 60s, 70s....
A woman remembers that she was one of the cool kids when she was a cheerleader.
So, she tries to re-capture those years from her early 20s into her 50s,
60s, 70s....
There's an episode of "Friends" where Rachel feels like she's failing and
can't get the guy- in her late 20s. So she runs and puts on her old cheerleader
costume, because it's never failed her. By the end of the episode, even she
admits it's a pitiful attempt at trying to recapture old glories and an
inability to face the present. When I've watched the episode, I've been
reminded of twi. Of course, it applies to the splinter groups as well.
Decades later, people want to imitate what hijacked the hippies. People in
the 21st century want a farm and recruits to do manual labor and exist in
programs entirely at the sufferance of the managers. In twi AND the splinters,
that's almost impossible- really beating the bushes means all of them get
a handful of people TOTAL. twi's stopped publishing numbers for their programs
since before the Corps graduated a grand total of FIVE PEOPLE one year and
the statistics skipped that number and reported them in PERCENTAGES.
"20% of the grads will do this, 20% will do this other thing." That means 1
person does 1 thing and another person does another thing.
But, that's all they know, and growing up and getting jobs and starting
families, doing something different and healthy,
is antithetical to the twi/ ex-twi vision,
so it's farms and manual labor and naive kids if you find any.
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excathedra
beta max
stupid f r u c k e rs
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outandabout
Know what happened to those who became exwafers? LIFE happened.
Oh yeah, we were sucked in via the promise of the more abundant LIFE. Guess we had to get out to live it.
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WordWolf
Caught something in passing the other day, on television.
Someone was saying that the US's current cults were now focusing
more on people in their 30s and older,
in order to leverage their pre-existing success and influence.
Another sign twi's decline is continuing the slow crawl into
night- along with all the offshoots. They're still unable to
draw significant numbers of new people at ANY age-
while other current cults are drawing in successful adults.
Really, twi and splinters are trading people back and forth
in a zero-sum game, and slowly losing people to them exiting,
or death, or growing up and leaving when they are able.
Their COLLECTIVE relevancy isn't even a blip on the radar.
In 20-40 years, they may not merit footnotes in someone's book.
There will be announcements of some deaths of "leaders" who
refused to hand over the reins while alive, and then some
silence, then an announcement of some land for sale or
auction. That will be the end of twi- not with a bang, but
with a whimper- and a quiet whimper at that. Some splinters
have already folded, a few will need a few more years until
old age takes their "leaders." The one with the young people?
If the young vpw namesake gets a clue, the thing will be done
soon after. If not, it will boast membership in the 2-3 digits
until something happens like he dies or they all die and he
decides he should do something else.
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skyrider
Or....as in the case of CFF,
Shroyer bequeathed the reins of his ministry [CFF]
to his granddaughter.....something that she requested
from her 'dear grandfather' many years prior to his death.
Now, she is cff's prez.
See......that's how "spiritual" that group is.
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chockfull
Right on everybody. It really is telling to me that when we all start thinking of that term in the Bible life - zoe - life in all of it's manifestations, why is it that more of that has started to open up to us once we stopped listening to the Pharisees?
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Rocky
I was going to start a new thread but when I saw this one, I thought it might fit here. I hope so, anyway.
A couple of weeks ago, I was in youtube looking at some video clips. To my surprise,
Probably, I had previously looked for clips from dickedher (wierwille) or twi. Anyway, it was posted by a cult sycophant named Maurice Goulet.
I posted a comment and fortunately saved the comment to a separate file because it disappeared from youtube in less than 24 hours.
Here's what I wrote:
-----
My experience with Wierwille was first hand. He was a mean, nasty, narcissistic SOB.
He used and abused anyone he could, especially those of us gullible enough to enlist, as young adults, in the Way Corps (I was in the 9th).
He built a subculture based on the works of others (plagiarism). His "Way Tree" had accountability completely backward. Instead of, as was in the Book of Acts, the traveling ministers were accountable to the people who provided their sustinence, whenever Wierwille traveled, his minions were instructed to provide him with every comfort and luxury, but don't dare demand accountability from him. In other words, in his arrogance, he believed he did not have to answer to anyone. As a result, he used many of the young female WOWs and Way Corps for his personal toys in the 1970s and early 1980s. He holds a great deal of responsibility for what LC Martindale did that got him tossed aside by The Way. Wierwille both mentored Martindale and built the closed subculture of reckless abuse of women that Martindale got caught up in and perpetuated after Wierwille's death.
Martin Buber wrote (I and Thou) about the difference between people and things. Wierwille preached that people were to love and things were to be used. But he DID exactly the opposite in far too many instances.
I don't know that "mainstream media" even knows or cares who Wierwille was anymore, let alone believe anything about him. Having personally worked in corporate media, and now blogging regularly, I know that there is plenty of information online to document what Wierwille actually did.
Furthermore, his "foundational class" was FULL of irrational, non-logical and unsound arguments.
That class was nothing but indoctrination into a mindset where he set himself up to be the ONLY authority on what was the will of God.
His interpretation of Proverbs 29:18 is a poignant case in point.
There may be redeeming social value in a close examination of the history of The Way for understanding how people can be indoctrinated and change their behavior without basis in rational sound reasoning. But as far as I'm concerned, that's about it.
If you want to know the God of the Bible, you'll probably need to cast off a good bit of what you may have learned as a result of Wierwille's "ministry."
-----
I used Goulet's name on purpose. Maybe he'll think more about whether he wants to continue to bow down to dickedher's legacy if he knows that he can't completely disassociate his name from the legitimate criticism.
And Skyrider, I agree completely with your point about twi not providing room for people to grow up.
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excathedra
quite some time ago, i had posted -- the name of thread might be Hunt Close -- i don't know -- that as a newlywed i asked wierwille what he could suggest regarding my learning how to raise a child/children
he recommended a dog book called "Hunt Close" which I bought lol expecting some heavy spiritual insight
yeah wierwille was a dog
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WordWolf
Here's links to some threads on child-raising and/or marriage in twi:
Hunt Close!
Child Abuse in twi
Comedy of error
Marriage in twi
Ephesians 6:1 and being in the way international
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skyrider
1st Gear........Recruitment Gear
Tell your friends, knock on doors, witness at malls......recruit, recruit, recruit.
Go to twig, try to get sign-ups for class.......and then, monitor him thru the class.
Newbie looks around abit and then leaves twi....another one "bites the dust."
No new people at twig tonight.....the leader takes everyone out witnessing.
Repeat.
Twi is a cult.
They DO NOT WANT you innies to find 2nd gear.
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GrouchoMarxJr
...I don't think there ever was a 2nd gear...
The Ohio grifter only had one purpose in mind...filling his own egotistical needs.
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outandabout
Be miserable because you have to "witness" all the time or feel guilty if you don't. Recruit recruit so you can bring in other people to be miserable like you. Yeah that works.
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