Wayfernot, I think it's wonderful what you did. I know the million protestations, 'well they could use it for drugs, booze, whatever' but like you, I figure that it is up to them to decide how to use it.
I also quit going to Mexico there when I lived in San Diego because it just broke my heart with all the children begging on the streets and I just didn't have enough money to give to all...
I do give regularly....and I'm not saying that to brag but just to say I have stepped outside the lines of if it ain't going to God, it ain't doing anyone any good.
I believe when ever and how ever we give, and the heart is right and/or it helps, it goes to God.
Wayfer ---- yea, I do the same thing. I see the sign "hungry, on the road, please help. God bless"
And always with a black magic marker on cardboard. Sometimes I feel "led" to help them, and other times not.
Times that I have tho, I go to the nearest quick food joint , buy a meal, and write the check for an extra 5 dollars. Then I go back to where they were, and hand them the sack, say God bless you, and tell them there is money in the sack as well as food.
I have done this several times, and only once was I dissappointed at the reaction I got from "the one in need".
One time however, I bought wayyyyy more than I figured was needed, for the guy by the over-pass. I circled around, and what do you know -- He was feeding a whole family with what I had bought there on the grass by the over-pass. Got misty then, and am doing so now, thinking how God can use even me to minister to those in need.
People in need are just that -------- people in need. They need not wear any other banner, they are asking for help. God Bless you for what you did, and may all of us do the same, as these situations arise.
When we were in twi, it was discouraged very much to NOT give money to strangers, homeless, etc.
I know what you mean. If I remember the party line, we were supposed to minister the Word to them and then God would take care of them.
How arrogant was that belief. What angers me so much now is the thought of how much good we could have done if we would have devoted our youthful energies to actually doing some good for other people. Just imagine with the degree of faith we had and the love in most of our hearts what kind of "Habitat" homes we could have built. What kind of money could we have gone out and raised to feed the hungry and then did so? Think of the kind of teachers for the young and for the illiterate we could have made? Can you imagine what we could have done had we walked the walk of Christ as well as talked the talk? But no. We were taught to simply go speak the Word and let God handle the rest. This arrogant little clique.
Why didn't we see that a big way to show them "Christ in you" was to act Christ-like. He didn't act like a way-brained cultie. When he saw hunger, he fed the poor. When he saw sickness, he healed the sick. When he saw despair, he comforted. The "ministry" said "all 9 all the time." So, most of us used that as a cop-out. If we get the "word of knowledge," we'll help the poor or heal the sick or whatever. Duh. The Bible gave us a bigger "word of knowledge" than any private revelation. It said to do that. Look at Acts. They sold plurality and distributed to those that had need. We took plurality and distributed to whom?
When I finally realized how misguided I was by this, I was too darned old to do what I really wanted to do. I had my family to take care of and responsibilities. I know that sounds like a cop-out, but there is only so much energy available. (Mind you I still do what I can -- but that amounts to only a couple of days a month, nothing compared to the amount of energy I had in my 20s and 30s.)
I do have some stories to tell about panhandling...but that's another post.
In my own not so professional opinion, TWI like many Protestant religions (that I have seen) have misunderstood and mis-used Jesus words that he spoke to Judas about the rich ointment that was going to be used on Jesus insted of being sold to the poor....namely...the poor you have always with you....as an excuse or rationale to take one's wealth and use it to further whatever church/organization or what have you that you belong to.
I personally believe that Jesus was exposing Judas' duplicity (which we knew that Judas didn't care for the poor and was a thief and was using this for an excuse) by pointing out that if he did care for the poor truly, he would have been providing for them, continually, and not just on special occasions, holidays or when super good fortune smacks you between the eyes. And if the poor were being taken care of in the way the OT said (Deut 15:11, especially 7-11) then there would be no problem with Jesus receiving the ointment.
TWI took the saying (along with some other denominations, not all, as there are churches who do and have worked with the poor) to being discriminatory agains the poor. Give it to Jesus, give it all to us as opposed to when Jesus said the poor should be receiving their portion all the time and this could go to him then.
You forget that the main mode of operation for twi is: if you give others money, that will be less for twi...if you own a house, you'll likely spend money on it instead of giving it to them...if you don't take their classes, you won't be giving it to twi...if you pay interest on a credit card, that's money you could have given to twi.
It's our money & now we are free to do whatever we want with it.
We still "tithe" but only what we can afford, but we do it faithfully. We give to some churches, homeless, missions. and also friends that need a little help. We a;ways give to the Fred Jordan ministries and mission especially in the cold months to buy blankets for the homeless.
I think its wonderful that we can give or not give if we want to. I don't have to worry about that hedge of protection sort of thing. I can give because I want to. It tends to be more of a cheerful heart when I can give because I want to help someone.
I really like to give of my time. Time to me is more important than money.
If you do not tell the truth about yourself you can not tell it about other people.
I don't care either way...if they ask and I have it - it's theirs. and the reward is in the giving...makes my day every time...
judge not lest ye be judged...perfectly wonderful sentiment until you add "but"...
There is nothing wrong with saying no. We have the right to say no. It's convincing ourselves we are doing the right thing-saying no- where the real internal issue is...Why do we have to label "bum" "lazy" "drunk"...etc. to make it right in ourselves? That is the kind of question you have to answer when you are seeking truth...
My dad always gave to who would people think of bums. They would come to his shop and ask for money. Instead of money he would go take them out to eat. He felt that giving a bum money for booze was wrong but wanted to make sure that he was fed. I think that it was great of him to do that.
If you do not tell the truth about yourself you can not tell it about other people.
Sorry, Chwester...I keep forgetting, you are one of those hand picked, especially loved by God people...whose hatred, prejudice, superiority, God loves America better than the rest of the world, are good moral character...
I keep forgetting that as long as you are "righteously" angry about something or someone...you sleep better at night...
I keep forgetting as long as you can point to others...you never need to look in...scary place to go...the kingdom of God...
One day, in California this gorgeous blonde woman was pushing a cart in semi-dirty clothes. She had a bunch of odd things in her cart and wanted to go into the store but did not want anyone taking her stuff.
She looked at me and asked, "Will you watch my stuff, please? I would like to go in the store."
So, I put all the money I had in her cart. Then, my hubs came up and asked what I was doing? I told him I was watching the cart for a homeless woman. HE had seen me put money in her cart and began to yell at me. (And he has never been TWI). So, I took some of it back so he would shut-up. (I think I told him the rest of it was there -- so he would be quiet)
I have felt bad about that to this day.
Gotta tell you she could have been anyone of our friends. She spoke well and was gorgeous.
(I often wonder if it was an angel sent to see how I would handle things).
But there were guys who would have the sign "Will work for food" so, one day a friend of mine pulled up and offered the guy $50.00 and a meal to clean his garage and the guy said, "I'm not doing that!"
But the biggie thing that happened was I had never really KNEW someone on the streets.
One day in San Francisco, my hubs and I were walking around with a little map on where it was safe and unsafe to go. We did wind up in an unsafe part of town and saw a knife fight on the corner between two homeless men. As we readied to make our departure, I heard "Dot? is that you?"
This dirty man, who sat against a building on the street with the others, was looking at me --It was my corps brother. OH MY GAWD!
I had been inspired to take extra money that morning and I dug it out of my hiding place and gave it to him. My husband and I were pretty upset all day to see someone I knew in that state. All he had was a clear plastic bag with some lime juice and change. I think that was it as I recall.
That experience put a face on the homeless for me.
we Give money to people who need it , friends , Family , we don't hold back for the ministry anymore as we were Told ," don't give to second rate causes , if you have more give more to the ministry ".
not any more , if someone asks for help we give it not because we need to , to prove that we are doing the Word but because we want to.
Ah yes, the "don't give to second rate/designer causes" days...
I don't give to everyone I encounter, but much much more than the Waydaze. There was a guy with a sign that read " I'm not gonna lie, I want to get a beer!" I laughed & gave him a couple of bucks; at least he wasn't scamming.
...on the 8th Day, GOD made the Harley, & it was Good.
I don't know about anyone else, but when I go to the supermarket I almost always see people begging for money of some sort. You see poor little children being prodded by their overweight parents looking on. They put these little kids on the spot, begging for money. Its nauseating.
I don't know about anyone else, but when I go to the supermarket I almost always see people begging for money of some sort. You see poor little children being prodded by their overweight parents looking on. They put these little kids on the spot, begging for money. Its nauseating.
Please go get a job and stop bothering me.
How'd I guess that not only would you slam beggars, but fat people, too...all in one sentence?
Gee whiz OM, you do live in a country that does not require you to address anyone even if you are addressed. You can keep walking. But on the other hand, you could help improve someone's life......if you wanted to. ;)--> The choice is yours. Hope I don't meet you on the street if I am ever in need.
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Mandii
In my own not so professional opinion, TWI like many Protestant religions (that I have seen) have misunderstood and mis-used Jesus words that he spoke to Judas about the rich ointment that was going t
Mandii
Wayfernot, I think it's wonderful what you did. I know the million protestations, 'well they could use it for drugs, booze, whatever' but like you, I figure that it is up to them to decide how to use it.
I also quit going to Mexico there when I lived in San Diego because it just broke my heart with all the children begging on the streets and I just didn't have enough money to give to all...
I do give regularly....and I'm not saying that to brag but just to say I have stepped outside the lines of if it ain't going to God, it ain't doing anyone any good.
I believe when ever and how ever we give, and the heart is right and/or it helps, it goes to God.
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Oakspear
WN:
I usually give when I feel like it! Panhandlers, neighbors, co-workers, whatever...sometimes I feel like giving, sometimes not.
The only thing that gets my back up is when someone I turn down gives me some crap because I didn't give to them.
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice...but in practice there is
Oakspear
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dmiller
Wayfer ---- yea, I do the same thing. I see the sign "hungry, on the road, please help. God bless"
And always with a black magic marker on cardboard. Sometimes I feel "led" to help them, and other times not.
Times that I have tho, I go to the nearest quick food joint , buy a meal, and write the check for an extra 5 dollars. Then I go back to where they were, and hand them the sack, say God bless you, and tell them there is money in the sack as well as food.
I have done this several times, and only once was I dissappointed at the reaction I got from "the one in need".
One time however, I bought wayyyyy more than I figured was needed, for the guy by the over-pass. I circled around, and what do you know -- He was feeding a whole family with what I had bought there on the grass by the over-pass. Got misty then, and am doing so now, thinking how God can use even me to minister to those in need.
People in need are just that -------- people in need. They need not wear any other banner, they are asking for help. God Bless you for what you did, and may all of us do the same, as these situations arise.
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markomalley
I know what you mean. If I remember the party line, we were supposed to minister the Word to them and then God would take care of them.
How arrogant was that belief. What angers me so much now is the thought of how much good we could have done if we would have devoted our youthful energies to actually doing some good for other people. Just imagine with the degree of faith we had and the love in most of our hearts what kind of "Habitat" homes we could have built. What kind of money could we have gone out and raised to feed the hungry and then did so? Think of the kind of teachers for the young and for the illiterate we could have made? Can you imagine what we could have done had we walked the walk of Christ as well as talked the talk? But no. We were taught to simply go speak the Word and let God handle the rest. This arrogant little clique.
Why didn't we see that a big way to show them "Christ in you" was to act Christ-like. He didn't act like a way-brained cultie. When he saw hunger, he fed the poor. When he saw sickness, he healed the sick. When he saw despair, he comforted. The "ministry" said "all 9 all the time." So, most of us used that as a cop-out. If we get the "word of knowledge," we'll help the poor or heal the sick or whatever. Duh. The Bible gave us a bigger "word of knowledge" than any private revelation. It said to do that. Look at Acts. They sold plurality and distributed to those that had need. We took plurality and distributed to whom?
When I finally realized how misguided I was by this, I was too darned old to do what I really wanted to do. I had my family to take care of and responsibilities. I know that sounds like a cop-out, but there is only so much energy available. (Mind you I still do what I can -- but that amounts to only a couple of days a month, nothing compared to the amount of energy I had in my 20s and 30s.)
I do have some stories to tell about panhandling...but that's another post.
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Mandii
In my own not so professional opinion, TWI like many Protestant religions (that I have seen) have misunderstood and mis-used Jesus words that he spoke to Judas about the rich ointment that was going to be used on Jesus insted of being sold to the poor....namely...the poor you have always with you....as an excuse or rationale to take one's wealth and use it to further whatever church/organization or what have you that you belong to.
I personally believe that Jesus was exposing Judas' duplicity (which we knew that Judas didn't care for the poor and was a thief and was using this for an excuse) by pointing out that if he did care for the poor truly, he would have been providing for them, continually, and not just on special occasions, holidays or when super good fortune smacks you between the eyes. And if the poor were being taken care of in the way the OT said (Deut 15:11, especially 7-11) then there would be no problem with Jesus receiving the ointment.
TWI took the saying (along with some other denominations, not all, as there are churches who do and have worked with the poor) to being discriminatory agains the poor. Give it to Jesus, give it all to us as opposed to when Jesus said the poor should be receiving their portion all the time and this could go to him then.
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Mandii
double post
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LuckyGirl
You forget that the main mode of operation for twi is: if you give others money, that will be less for twi...if you own a house, you'll likely spend money on it instead of giving it to them...if you don't take their classes, you won't be giving it to twi...if you pay interest on a credit card, that's money you could have given to twi.
It's our money & now we are free to do whatever we want with it.
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wyteduv58
We still "tithe" but only what we can afford, but we do it faithfully. We give to some churches, homeless, missions. and also friends that need a little help. We a;ways give to the Fred Jordan ministries and mission especially in the cold months to buy blankets for the homeless.
Dovey....proud owner of two low riders...Dovey's Doxies...... too dumb to post pics http://gscafe.com/groupee/forums?s=9716057...a&ul=4846073735
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vickles
I think its wonderful that we can give or not give if we want to. I don't have to worry about that hedge of protection sort of thing. I can give because I want to. It tends to be more of a cheerful heart when I can give because I want to help someone.
I really like to give of my time. Time to me is more important than money.
If you do not tell the truth about yourself you can not tell it about other people.
virginia woolfe
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chwester
I have given money to strangers a few times, but not every time.
I try to "size them up" and see if they just need a little help because of temporary circumstances or are just bums.
Proud to be an American
www.northpoint.org
www.anncoulter.org
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karmicdebt
I don't care either way...if they ask and I have it - it's theirs. and the reward is in the giving...makes my day every time...
judge not lest ye be judged...perfectly wonderful sentiment until you add "but"...
There is nothing wrong with saying no. We have the right to say no. It's convincing ourselves we are doing the right thing-saying no- where the real internal issue is...Why do we have to label "bum" "lazy" "drunk"...etc. to make it right in ourselves? That is the kind of question you have to answer when you are seeking truth...
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chwester
Any alcoholics need money for booze?--email Karmicdebt.
Proud to be an American
www.northpoint.org
www.anncoulter.org
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vickles
LOL chwester
My dad always gave to who would people think of bums. They would come to his shop and ask for money. Instead of money he would go take them out to eat. He felt that giving a bum money for booze was wrong but wanted to make sure that he was fed. I think that it was great of him to do that.
If you do not tell the truth about yourself you can not tell it about other people.
virginia woolfe
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karmicdebt
Sorry, Chwester...I keep forgetting, you are one of those hand picked, especially loved by God people...whose hatred, prejudice, superiority, God loves America better than the rest of the world, are good moral character...
I keep forgetting that as long as you are "righteously" angry about something or someone...you sleep better at night...
I keep forgetting as long as you can point to others...you never need to look in...scary place to go...the kingdom of God...
Party on!
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Kit Sober
I'd rather be a fool for Christ than a religious tight-wad.
IMHO the big reason why vpw discouraged giving to ANYTHING other than twi was because he wanted it all -- all allegience as well as all our money.
(I pray for every gift to go to the heart -- and who knows, but that maybe the alcoholic maybe quickened to fing the courage to go to an AA meeting.)
Hopefully
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Dot Matrix
One day, in California this gorgeous blonde woman was pushing a cart in semi-dirty clothes. She had a bunch of odd things in her cart and wanted to go into the store but did not want anyone taking her stuff.
She looked at me and asked, "Will you watch my stuff, please? I would like to go in the store."
So, I put all the money I had in her cart. Then, my hubs came up and asked what I was doing? I told him I was watching the cart for a homeless woman. HE had seen me put money in her cart and began to yell at me. (And he has never been TWI). So, I took some of it back so he would shut-up. (I think I told him the rest of it was there -- so he would be quiet)
I have felt bad about that to this day.
Gotta tell you she could have been anyone of our friends. She spoke well and was gorgeous.
(I often wonder if it was an angel sent to see how I would handle things).
But there were guys who would have the sign "Will work for food" so, one day a friend of mine pulled up and offered the guy $50.00 and a meal to clean his garage and the guy said, "I'm not doing that!"
But the biggie thing that happened was I had never really KNEW someone on the streets.
One day in San Francisco, my hubs and I were walking around with a little map on where it was safe and unsafe to go. We did wind up in an unsafe part of town and saw a knife fight on the corner between two homeless men. As we readied to make our departure, I heard "Dot? is that you?"
This dirty man, who sat against a building on the street with the others, was looking at me --It was my corps brother. OH MY GAWD!
I had been inspired to take extra money that morning and I dug it out of my hiding place and gave it to him. My husband and I were pretty upset all day to see someone I knew in that state. All he had was a clear plastic bag with some lime juice and change. I think that was it as I recall.
That experience put a face on the homeless for me.
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Junior
we Give money to people who need it , friends , Family , we don't hold back for the ministry anymore as we were Told ," don't give to second rate causes , if you have more give more to the ministry ".
not any more , if someone asks for help we give it not because we need to , to prove that we are doing the Word but because we want to.
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Dot Matrix
Kit
ROTFL
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Shellon
Interesting that many many people are but one paycheck from being in these people's places. Scarey stuff.
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Weout1200
Ah yes, the "don't give to second rate/designer causes" days...
I don't give to everyone I encounter, but much much more than the Waydaze. There was a guy with a sign that read " I'm not gonna lie, I want to get a beer!" I laughed & gave him a couple of bucks; at least he wasn't scamming.
...on the 8th Day, GOD made the Harley, & it was Good.
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oldiesman
I don't know about anyone else, but when I go to the supermarket I almost always see people begging for money of some sort. You see poor little children being prodded by their overweight parents looking on. They put these little kids on the spot, begging for money. Its nauseating.
Please go get a job and stop bothering me.
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CoolWaters
How'd I guess that not only would you slam beggars, but fat people, too...all in one sentence?
Sigh.
?????????????
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Nottawayfer
Gee whiz OM, you do live in a country that does not require you to address anyone even if you are addressed. You can keep walking. But on the other hand, you could help improve someone's life......if you wanted to.
;)--> The choice is yours. Hope I don't meet you on the street if I am ever in need.
Laughter is a tranquilizer with no side effects.
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Mandii
I would say, OM...that you're such a tease, taunting us over what we belive in...but oh well.
Perhaps some dramamine for that nausea? Just hold out your hand (a hand out???) and I'll give you some
;)--> 
;)--> 
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