What drew me to twi in the first place was their "unconditional acceptance" of anyone and everyone who wanted to be a part of it..."We have no strangers at the Way"...remember that one?...Veepee used to teach that if someone walks away from the fellowship and then returns a year later, you welcome them back with open arms. Those were sentiments that I appreciated.
The biggest regret that I have, is that I didn't march into martinfart's office and tell that mean spirited little weasel off.
Getting "In Trouble"?...If they ever bother me again, I'll show them what REAL trouble is...maybe a few pop knots on somebody's head.
I think I spent about half of my chilhood in "trouble".. heh heh. From saying/doing/thinking the dumbest stuff, rolling in poison ivy, etc. etc. One good thing about it though.. through all the good and bad times, my parents still loved me. In da vey, there was no or little love involved, at least toward the end of my involvement.
You'd think that once you come of age, that the old threat "you are gonna get it now.." just is not appropriate. I have seen adults- over forty- treated like "disobedient" two year olds by teen-age snot nosed-but by a miracle out of debt sons of bitches "leadership". Apparently, you never "grow up" in Da Vey.
So no one talked anymore - no one complained - no one criticized anything for fear of the trouble it would cause if anyone repeated what you'd said.
It was just another way of TWI controlling people's lives. Another form of fear.
Hope......yeah, it really got nazi-crazy!!!
On several occasions, I witnessed full-scale intimidation and scathing attacks by wierwille. But generally, these were all CLOSED SOCIETY SLANDERINGS........in other words, in corps meetings or behind closed doors. Wierwille used great discretion in public.
Martindale never grasped this type of discretion. He used his doctrine of "spiritual anger" as a springboard to launch heightened verbal abuse. Martindale could NOT control his tongue.....and was blind-sided by his own ego. And, his yes-men.....the region guys were an extension of his policies and mode of operation.
I remember my very first corps advance I attended.
Just to give a bit of history here...I entered the corps but only lasted 1 yr. I got into trouble for everything. I was not necessarily the aggressive type who mouthed off to leaders, but just the opposite. So I think leaders took advantage of that fact, and pounce on my head at every given chance.
After that fiasco, I did end up marrying a corps person (who by the way I still love dearly cause he was NEVER a NAZI!!!) so here I was again in the a corps environment.
Now, back to the corps advance.
I for weeks before the event, cried each night and told my husband I did not want to go. He could go alone and I would be fine to just stay home. He could not understand why I felt this way.
Finally through much anguish, I told him the reason why I felt the way I did. The reason was that I felt I would get into trouble and be yelled at publicly for something I'm sure they would find I was doing wrong in my life.
I did attend the weekend and nothing of the sort happened. But, that was because some beautiful people like (Sky ;)-->) ran it.
I felt I had been conditioned like one of Pavlov's dogs.
Gawd, Hope! When you put it that way it sounds so childish and stupid. I'm really embarrassed now!
Yep, I spent at least 9 years worried about "getting into trouble." The first coupla years I couldn't have cared less, but then again, I think things weren't as legalistic during that time either. I never had to mind my Ps & Qs with my parents to the degree I felt like I had to with TWI. I did fear getting into trouble at home, mind you, but I knew the punishment would be deserved, swift and fair. TWI wasn't that way.
My parents also continued to love me regardless of how stupid, harmful or frustrating my behavior. I never worried about them kicking me out of the house, out of the family and never speaking to me again. No kid should ever have to worry about that! If TWI is the model of how a Christian family should be, I don't want to be in a Christian family.
I'm suddenly reminded of a classic Twilight Zone episode. The one where this five-year-old kid played by Billy Mumy ran the world had this power to whisk people into the cornfield if they ever disagreed or complained about the way he ran things.
So everybody put on their happy faces even though the situation was very bizarre. They had no freedom to speak their minds.
Btw, this is my first post! There will be many more :)-->
Wow, that reminds me of once when I was driving to a meeting of some sort, I was crying, and praying out loud, "Please God, don't let me get yelled at this time."
Your post brought that back. Wow was that ever sick to even be in something like that.
At the meeting I actually got spoken well of by the leader. I guess God heard my prayer. :)-->
Yes, it is amazing that we were reduced to such thinking!!
To think that we were praying to God to not be abused. God must have been crying in heaven to see such a mess.
It was the complete opposite to what TWI claimed they taught. Remember they taught that Righteousness was being able to stand before God without any sense of sin, fear or guilt.
Sheeshh......again.... did they ever miss that mark!!! luke John and Ringo too!
Amazing that we kept going back even though we hated going and were afraid to go. Man, I wish I had given myself more credit for being able to take care of me back then. I thought they knew what was better for me and my life which is why I gave my power away to them. Then, when I finally realized it didn't seem right, I was so entrenched it was almost impossible to see the way out.
Now, I'm beginning to feel more comfortable and capable of taking care of myself. I'm not doing such a bad job of it either, if I may say so.
Tex, I'm looking forward to reading your story. It's always nice to read about someone else's experiences and to get to know the people posting here a little better.
Many times, when my husband and I would argue about something, he would say,"I'm going to call (our LC) and talk to him about it." It was a threat to me to shut up about any disagreement and sent shivers down my spine. It was just like when I WAS a child - and my siblings "tattled" on me to my folks. GAWD! How insane! As if we were not able to resolve any conflicts ourselves. He "tattled" on me once and I was yelled at for weeks, put on a program for recovery, had to check in daily, etc. It was hell! I too, cried, when I had to attend even a fellowship, but especially any weekend meeting.
Now that we have been out for awhile, if we have a disagreement on something, I can almost read his frustration in his face. He can't tattle on me to anyone any more and we have to work it out ourselves.
Many times, when my husband and I would argue about something, he would say,"I'm going to call (our LC) and talk to him about it." It was a threat to me to shut up about any disagreement and sent shivers down my spine. It was just like when I WAS a child - and my siblings "tattled" on me to my folks. GAWD! How insane! As if we were not able to resolve any conflicts ourselves. He "tattled" on me once and I was yelled at for weeks, put on a program for recovery, had to check in daily, etc. It was hell! I too, cried, when I had to attend even a fellowship, but especially any weekend meeting.
Now that we have been out for awhile, if we have a disagreement on something, I can almost read his frustration in his face. He can't tattle on me to anyone any more and we have to work it out ourselves.
That is *really* sick, that your own husband would do that to you.
In my opinion, he should be down on his knees begging forgivness for that.
That is *really* sick, that your own husband would do that to you.
.
I gotta agree with you. That is a power play. Try that crap in the real world.
Then I think how twi had it all set up. According to twi he did what was right (I think). It is amazing though that he did not want the privacy of your relationship. I don't think he was Jesus Christ. I bet you could have tattled on him too.
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Steve!
Yeah, TWI is a *fine* example of the way that a father is supposed to be with his family.
Can't you just feel the Love of God oozing from every orifice of TWI?
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MATILDA
I don't recall that twi was ever supposed to be like a father to anyone...tht's pretty laffable in itself...lol.
The "father in the Word" jive was pure unadulterated horse manure, and a tweaky speaky (ala skyrider) buzz phrase that people bought into...
...do remember that (and still see viability in) the notion of Christianity being a way of a Father with his children, tho.
Trouble? Hope not.
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GrouchoMarxJr
What drew me to twi in the first place was their "unconditional acceptance" of anyone and everyone who wanted to be a part of it..."We have no strangers at the Way"...remember that one?...Veepee used to teach that if someone walks away from the fellowship and then returns a year later, you welcome them back with open arms. Those were sentiments that I appreciated.
The biggest regret that I have, is that I didn't march into martinfart's office and tell that mean spirited little weasel off.
Getting "In Trouble"?...If they ever bother me again, I'll show them what REAL trouble is...maybe a few pop knots on somebody's head.
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Steve!
Christianity being the way of a father with his family is exactly what I was referring to.
TWI is NOT a good example of Christianity, is my point.
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justloafing
Exactly. They would be in jail for child abuse.
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Ham
I think I spent about half of my chilhood in "trouble".. heh heh. From saying/doing/thinking the dumbest stuff, rolling in poison ivy, etc. etc. One good thing about it though.. through all the good and bad times, my parents still loved me. In da vey, there was no or little love involved, at least toward the end of my involvement.
You'd think that once you come of age, that the old threat "you are gonna get it now.." just is not appropriate. I have seen adults- over forty- treated like "disobedient" two year olds by teen-age snot nosed-but by a miracle out of debt sons of bitches "leadership". Apparently, you never "grow up" in Da Vey.
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skyrider
Hope......yeah, it really got nazi-crazy!!!
On several occasions, I witnessed full-scale intimidation and scathing attacks by wierwille. But generally, these were all CLOSED SOCIETY SLANDERINGS........in other words, in corps meetings or behind closed doors. Wierwille used great discretion in public.
Martindale never grasped this type of discretion. He used his doctrine of "spiritual anger" as a springboard to launch heightened verbal abuse. Martindale could NOT control his tongue.....and was blind-sided by his own ego. And, his yes-men.....the region guys were an extension of his policies and mode of operation.
The evolution of wickedness was rolling.
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Ham
Except for the few that left, they are STILL in charge.
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A la prochaine
Hope,
Great thread.
I remember my very first corps advance I attended.
Just to give a bit of history here...I entered the corps but only lasted 1 yr. I got into trouble for everything. I was not necessarily the aggressive type who mouthed off to leaders, but just the opposite. So I think leaders took advantage of that fact, and pounce on my head at every given chance.
After that fiasco, I did end up marrying a corps person (who by the way I still love dearly cause he was NEVER a NAZI!!!) so here I was again in the a corps environment.
Now, back to the corps advance.
I for weeks before the event, cried each night and told my husband I did not want to go. He could go alone and I would be fine to just stay home. He could not understand why I felt this way.
Finally through much anguish, I told him the reason why I felt the way I did. The reason was that I felt I would get into trouble and be yelled at publicly for something I'm sure they would find I was doing wrong in my life.
I did attend the weekend and nothing of the sort happened. But, that was because some beautiful people like (Sky
;)-->) ran it.
I felt I had been conditioned like one of Pavlov's dogs.
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A la prochaine
A few of you mentioned TWI and it's unchristian like way.
I just listened to this song written by an NON-TWI person
gasP!!!
and I think these words are some of the most beautiful Godly inspired words I have ever heard.
This is sung by Alison Krauss and written by one of her band members Ron Block.
Enjoy
:)-->
-------------------------------------------
A LIVING PRAYER
(Ron Block)
In this world I walk alone with no place to call my home
But there's One who holds my hand
The rugged road through barren lands
The way is dark, the road is steep
But He's become my eyes to see
The strength to climb, my griefs to bear
This Savior lives inside me there
In Your love I find release
A haven from my unbelief
Take my life and let me be
A living prayer my God to thee
In these trials of life I find
Another Voice inside my mind
He comforts me and bids me live
Inside the love the Father gives
In your love I find release
A haven from my unbelief
Take my life and let me be
A living prayer my God to thee
take my life and let me be
A living prayer my God to thee
------------------------------------------
this line: He comforts me and bids me live
Inside the love the Father gives
sends shivers down my spine. TWI so missed the mark
-->
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Belle
Gawd, Hope! When you put it that way it sounds so childish and stupid. I'm really embarrassed now!
Yep, I spent at least 9 years worried about "getting into trouble." The first coupla years I couldn't have cared less, but then again, I think things weren't as legalistic during that time either. I never had to mind my Ps & Qs with my parents to the degree I felt like I had to with TWI. I did fear getting into trouble at home, mind you, but I knew the punishment would be deserved, swift and fair. TWI wasn't that way.
My parents also continued to love me regardless of how stupid, harmful or frustrating my behavior. I never worried about them kicking me out of the house, out of the family and never speaking to me again. No kid should ever have to worry about that! If TWI is the model of how a Christian family should be, I don't want to be in a Christian family.
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outintexas
I'm suddenly reminded of a classic Twilight Zone episode. The one where this five-year-old kid played by Billy Mumy ran the world had this power to whisk people into the cornfield if they ever disagreed or complained about the way he ran things.
So everybody put on their happy faces even though the situation was very bizarre. They had no freedom to speak their minds.
Btw, this is my first post! There will be many more
:)-->
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Steve!
Well, howdy, Tex, and welcome to da spot!
I'm sure Raf will be along presently with a cup of coffee for ya.
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A la prochaine
OUTINTEXAS
WELL HOWDY PARDNER!!!
Welcome to the caf?BR>Glad you enjoy the menu!
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WhiteDove
TROUBLE!!
"Why I've forgoten more about trouble than that boy will ever know"...
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Belle
Welcome, Tex!
:D--> Glad to have you here!
Raf does like to serve the first cup of coffee, but I'll be happy to buy you a danish or a muffin.
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outandabout
A la,
Wow, that reminds me of once when I was driving to a meeting of some sort, I was crying, and praying out loud, "Please God, don't let me get yelled at this time."
Your post brought that back. Wow was that ever sick to even be in something like that.
At the meeting I actually got spoken well of by the leader. I guess God heard my prayer.
:)-->
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outintexas
Thanks for the warm welcome
:)-->
I'll be posting "My Story" before too long.
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A la prochaine
Outandabout,
Yes, it is amazing that we were reduced to such thinking!!
To think that we were praying to God to not be abused. God must have been crying in heaven to see such a mess.
It was the complete opposite to what TWI claimed they taught. Remember they taught that Righteousness was being able to stand before God without any sense of sin, fear or guilt.
Sheeshh......again.... did they ever miss that mark!!! luke John and Ringo too!
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Belle
Amazing that we kept going back even though we hated going and were afraid to go. Man, I wish I had given myself more credit for being able to take care of me back then. I thought they knew what was better for me and my life which is why I gave my power away to them. Then, when I finally realized it didn't seem right, I was so entrenched it was almost impossible to see the way out.
Now, I'm beginning to feel more comfortable and capable of taking care of myself. I'm not doing such a bad job of it either, if I may say so.
Tex, I'm looking forward to reading your story. It's always nice to read about someone else's experiences and to get to know the people posting here a little better.
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Microbe
Many times, when my husband and I would argue about something, he would say,"I'm going to call (our LC) and talk to him about it." It was a threat to me to shut up about any disagreement and sent shivers down my spine. It was just like when I WAS a child - and my siblings "tattled" on me to my folks. GAWD! How insane! As if we were not able to resolve any conflicts ourselves. He "tattled" on me once and I was yelled at for weeks, put on a program for recovery, had to check in daily, etc. It was hell! I too, cried, when I had to attend even a fellowship, but especially any weekend meeting.
Now that we have been out for awhile, if we have a disagreement on something, I can almost read his frustration in his face. He can't tattle on me to anyone any more and we have to work it out ourselves.
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outandabout
Unbelievable!!!!!!! Boggles my mind to this day. In fact, the longer I've been out, the more boggled I get!!
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Steve!
That is *really* sick, that your own husband would do that to you.
In my opinion, he should be down on his knees begging forgivness for that.
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justloafing
I gotta agree with you. That is a power play. Try that crap in the real world.
Then I think how twi had it all set up. According to twi he did what was right (I think). It is amazing though that he did not want the privacy of your relationship. I don't think he was Jesus Christ. I bet you could have tattled on him too.
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