Leaderboard

Mike's apparent anger toward Christ and emphasis on obedience . . . that's Wayworld . . . that's the annihilation of the individual

Nasty descriptions of you? Mike, when you continue to agitate, stir conflict and refuse to engage those who challenge your statements and hypothesis....AND you get called on the carpet for it.....THAT is not "nasty descriptions of you." Why is it that you continuously make these bold [false] declarations of wierwille's writings knowing that he heavily plagiarized throughout his whole life? Why is it that you immediately run for cover and play the "victim card" whenever someone challenges your statements? You see, Mike.... you can't have it BOTH WAYS. You cannot come to GSC and make these false assertions without being challenged. All of this is antithetical to a discussion forum where facts, opinions and judgments are volleyed back and forth to further understanding. Mike, you first posted on GSC on December 27, 2002 with a preaching pronouncement entitled "Dr's Last Teaching - LOST for 17 years!" That thread alone expanded to 43 pages. After more than two decades of posting, I have long passed the threshold of giving you the benefit of doubt and surmise that you come to GSC for the sole satisfaction of CONFLICT. You like to agitate others. You seem to gain a sense of purpose by stirring the pot of conflicting statements for self gain [mental superiority over others]. And, although the vast majority disagrees with your statements... you are undeterred to keep coming back for more conflict. When it becomes abundantly obvious that your declarations are wrong and absurd... you use the evasive tactic of avoidance. You, instead, just move on to another conflicting statement or teaching. At no time, do you stop and reflect on your position. Why? Because in your mind.... you are right and all others are wrong. You are like a castaway on an island of your own making. And, you like it that way. .

I only know this phrase from The Way International. By "The Word" what is meant in The Way is The Bible. What is meant by The Bible is another topic. According to the article, LINK, God is not acting as a divine architect. You are not expected to make perfect decisions, ever. So what is the will of God? According to the article above, it's you. So, The Word of God is The Will of God is a phrase to take your attention off of, you, in some attempt to build the perfect machine.

BS. Trying to change topics, which you do most anytime you can't back up what wierwille says. We do differ on attitudes towards scripture because I respect what is written without using a bunch of cherrypicked definitions and such from the nearest concordance. Tools? How about holy spirit and relying on Christ/God as noted in scripture. 1 John 2:27 “But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.”

Thanks T-Bone, Your list shows how it's hard to take what Mike says seriously especially when it's in response to posts where scriptures are actually given.

And once again ... you are wrong...where on earth do you qualify as a dictionary..who care what you "see" what a word means...Let's define King James words with a King James dictionary. https://av1611.com/kjbp/kjv-dictionary/lord.html 1. A master; a person possessing supreme power and authority; a ruler; a governor. <--- Christ! There's plenty more definitions that don't apply to Christ... 2. A tyrant; an oppressive ruler. 3. A husband. I oft in bitterness of soul deplores my absent daughter, and my dearer lord. My lord also being old. Gen. 18. 4. A baron; the proprietor of a manor; as the lord of the manor. 5. A nobleman; a title of honor in Great Britain given to those who are noble by birth or creation; a peer of the realm, including dukes, marquises, earls, viscounts and barons. Archbishops and bishops also, as members of the house of lords, are lords of parliament. Thus we say, lords temporal and spiritual. By courtesy also the title is given to the sons of dukes and marquises, and to the eldest sons of earls. 6. An honorary title bestowed on certain official characters; as lord advocate, lord chamberlain, lord chancellor, lord chief justice, &c. 7. In scripture, the Supreme Being; Jehovah. When Lord, in the Old Testament, is prints in capitals, it is the translation of JEHOVAH, and so might, with more propriety, be rendered. The word is applied to Christ, Ps. 110. Col. 3. and to the Holy Spirit, 2Thess. 3. As a title of respect, it is applied to kings, Gen. 40. 2Sam. 19. to princes and nobles, Gen 42. Dan. 4. to a husband, Gen. 18. to a prophet, 1Kings 18. 2Kings 2. and to a respectable person, Gen. 24. Christ is called the Lord of glory, 1Cor. 2. and Lord of lords, Rev. 19.

In light of Rocky’s reminder to aim for progress in a discussion - I meant to ask you a few questions about this stuff too. 1. How does the devil tempt Christians with fake relationships with a fake Jesus? 2. Is it possible to have a real relationship with a fake Jesus? 3. Is it possible to have a fake relationship with a real Jesus? 4. What are your criteria to gauge if a Christian is having a relationship with a fake Jesus? 5. What indicates Christians are refusing to see and obey the church epistles? 6. What in the church epistles needs to be seen and obeyed? 7. Can you give examples of Christians seeking comfort in a lovey-dovey, chatty idolatry with a fake Jesus. 8. What is the tipping point when the behavior in a relationship becomes excessively affectionate (lovey-dovey) ? 9. What is the difference between chatty or informal idolatry and official idolatry? 10. Is this 'chatting idolatry' done only in public – or can it be done in private as well? 11. Why does it sadden you to see this chatty idolatry? 12. Please describe genuine comfort. 13. What in your opinion is the biggest reason why said Christians cannot provide relief to those seeking reconciliation with God?

All of THAT is about Mike. It's a set of reasonable inferences and conclusions based on more than two decades. NONE of what Mike "contributes" on GSC furthers discussion. I say my brother Skyrider nailed it.

How about finishing Penworks’ book Undertow first now switching to urgent public service message mode: why wait another administration to finish reading Undertow - don’t get left behind - of those in the know.

YOU have just described to a T the counterfeit ministry of wierwille! wierwille’s “relationship” with an imaginary god who tolerated his depraved lifestyle - he obeyed his own lusts instead of obeying the moral directives of the Bible. …self-love to the max ! wierwille had that lovey dovey chatty idolatry with an imaginary god and often let followers in on it - “Father showed me this” he used to say to slip in some hidden-Gnosticism-spin on a passage.”the Bible interprets itself” really means wierwille interprets it for you . Congrats, Mike you nailed it! Oh what wierwille-infused idolatry doth romp in cyberspace - if only one would realize it.

Wierwille and his subsequent BOD leaders have imposed far more traditions implemented with a heavy hand than any Christian denomination I am aware of. Well maybe not the Catholics. That group is like all tradition little substance. Sorry. And by traditions I mean they were actually not just traditions but rules that must be followed unquestioned with the fear of excommunication always hanging over the head. Sorry VP. If denominations created heavy handed traditions to rule believers, VP has created a three headed monster with eyes everywhere to rule over all aspects of life. Worse than a heavy hand.

3. Isolation -- within weeks, you are subtly being isolated from friends, family, information, past activities Within a matter of weeks of attending twig fellowship, the process of isolation has begun. You have entered the "recruitment stage".... to be another soldier in the cult's army. With phone calls and constant undershepherding, they have one immediate goal to achieve.... getting you into the pfal class. It all sounds so harmless. Who could ever imagine the path you'd have to tread just by taking a bible class? But pfal is far more sinister than just a bible class: Class sessions, generally, are scheduled for 4 nights per week... for 3 weeks. Lasting nearly 3 hours per night.... with only a strict 10-minute break. No questions allowed. Every session is packed with a volume of information.... "information overload." Assertions are made on biblical integrity that are not backed by scripture. Wierwille adds private interpretation to several conflicting verses of scripture. Stories are injected that add "zingers" of fear and/or confusion...ie little boy killed by car. "Every woman in the kingdom belongs to the king".... gives license to his sexual predation. Wierwille plants seeds of doubt when he denigrates churches/denominations. Recruitment begins in earnest...."To stand with the ministry that taught you the Word." Holy spirit field is paramount to vp's ministry.... even though his SIT is repetitive. Etc. etc. After pfal, you have come to a crossroads. Do you go back to your friends, family and activities... or, do you stand with "the ministry?" Some experts say that it takes three months to break a habit. Well, after about three months of attending twigs and taking pfal you have been re-formatted to be a cult follower. Now granted, the vast majority of pfal class grads EXITED and were never seen again at this juncture.... but for those who stayed, the isolation from life and society only increased from there. Two roads diverged before me..... I had a choice before me. Which one had the better claim? Robert Frost poem..... Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, And sorry I could not travel both And be one traveler, long I stood And looked down one as far as I could To where it bent in the undergrowth; Then took the other, as just as fair, And having perhaps the better claim, Because it was grassy and wanted wear; Though as for that the passing there Had worn them really about the same, And both that morning equally lay In leaves no step had trodden black. Oh, I kept the first for another day! Yet knowing how way leads on to way, I doubted if I should ever come back. I shall be telling this with a sigh Somewhere ages and ages hence: Two roads diverged in a wood, and I— I took the one less traveled by, And that has made all the difference. ~~~~~~ A difference that changed the trajectory of my life.

I think there was a bookcase or a cloak or something that contained the list of texts to canonize... maybe even a folder with a rough draft. There's good reason why vpw was afraid to talk about canon. There's a thread on this topic. It has a circular shape.

No, you are evasive, poking and prodding a conflict. Some might think you are the one being an agitator, a provocateur.

Thanks for the reminder - that’s one of my issues - I forget stuff

In twi, many followers have cult-like leaders who tell them what they should constantly be doing. For a lot of people who were in the corps or lived or worked at headquarters, their lives were pretty much run all the time by top leadership. Some motivations for them to obey leaders could be: in order to get along or get by; for the wages; out of loyalty or because of a desire to please or climb the ladder to a higher position. Thankfully the motivations to serve or help others while in twi can change after leaving and one is no longer under their control. I thought about this when reading Matthew 6 and I found it awesome as it relates to the hope. Jesus gives two motivations for practicing righteousness such as giving to the needy, praying and fasting. One is to do them openly in order to be noticed by others and receive their praise as a reward and the other is to do them in secret where it’s just between you and the God you honor. For those who choose the latter, Jesus says they will be rewarded by God. Jesus concludes with verses 19-21: “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. As I learned more about the hope, the more verse 21 stood out. In this context, “treasures” (being the things we find precious) are either on earth (the rewards that come from men) or are in heaven (the rewards that come from God). Loving and helping others from the heart is in the same place as our treasure in heaven. They are both intrinsically connected! They go hand in hand like two peas in a pod or whatever other idiom you can think of that applies. When you do the first, you are reminded of the second. Or when you remember the second, you do the first. So I can see better now that the reality and joy of the hope is realized every time we love and help others. Instead of the heaviness of heart I felt earlier, it's like on air! Thank God .