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curious

In regards to the recent trend of "is twi worth our efforts anymore"...my opinion is that if twi is faltering and shrinking for "various" reasons...it's not the time to let up on them...now is the time to put the boots to them and finish them off...after that, we can go after the splinter groups like nazi war criminals... This entire Wierwillian philosophy of "power of the mind" should probably be labeled as witchcraft...his disciples continue on like mold growing in a dark damp place. I am repulsed by what they do to people. They rape the mind and ravage the soul. ...Because of what they have done...I will continue to do the Mexican hat dance on their faces.... Any thoughts?

The current thread on "Inactive Notices" started me thinking. Why has The Way put PFAL, the class that started it all, on inactive status? This is not so much about why it was replaced, but why it remains in mothballs, long after the vociferous herald of "present truth" has slipped into obscurity. It was promoted as the greatest inroad to Biblical insight since the first century. It promised to answer questions that have plagued mankind for millennia. It came with a lengthy laundry list of ways it could improve one's life (ie: The Green Card) One poster has even suggested it was God-Breathed and, as such, replaces The Bible. They even tried to upgrade it once, in 1977, but found, much to their chagrin, that it was simply too "perfect" to be improved upon. So why wouldn't The Way hold it up like a cherished treasure for all the world to behold and revel in? Are they afraid it will come under a level of scrutiny that couldn't have been imagined at its conception? Are they afraid it will stand naked, with all its imperfections and deformities, in front of the world's picture window? It's like building a house and pretending the foundation doesn't exist. Perhaps some current or recent (non)member could come to the fore and offer some insight.

I was in the lobby of the local museum of art where he was teaching in the auditorium. He was walking through the lobby. I can't remember if I walked up to him, or the other way around, but I do remember that he took my offered hand, held it too long, and looked at me like all he wanted to do was get in my pants. The next time I met him was at an impromptu meeting at our local limb when he was going through on the Harley and motor coach. For whatever reason I was invited. There were about 50 of us in there and I was sitting in the back with JAL's dad being all snarky. I recall the reverence towards him by the others, but I figured if he was going to sit up there practically chain smoking and drinking, then we weren't really having a god meeting, it was just a get-together. He was co-mingling pretty well there before and after, but there's nothing that particularly stood out in my mind other than some people feeling the need to monopolize his time.

I have three encounters. my first was at Gunnison .. I was a recent PFAL grad and went to hear the "great Man"(sarcasm) speak there. he was expounding on the fact that the word divides family and we should not allow our family to stand in the way of our walk with GAWD! after which I wanted to go up and say hello to him and shake his hand but was deterred by the Corps person I was with.. how rude of me to intrude on the time of such an important man of God. Stupidly I listened to them and did not go over to say hello. Next I was at ROA getting ready to go WOW . I ran in to him twice there once when I was wandering in the woods and he was wandering through there.. Corps was clearing everyone out.. like we were all terrorists lying in wait to assassinate him. I had just needed some time to sort out what I was doing .. alone .. unfortunately the way woods was the only place not spilling over with people. I thought VP was being a bit arrogant. And the poor Corps who was guarding it when I came walking out was scared stiff.. how did they miss me, where had I been.. Did anyone else see me back there...Now I suspect he was afraid he would get dressed down if anyone knew they had missed me clearing out the way woods. By the way it really was just a walk thru the woods he was there and Loy boy and a couple of Way guards. Really they were just talking and wandering thru no big deal really but you would have thought he was some head of state with a price on his head they way everyone carried on. My third encounter was at that same ROA... I was working (I volunteered ) and was manning the gate the one that ran between tent city and the food court.... any way I was told to keep an eye out for his cart and open the gate and don't fall down he would run you over. well yep I tripped and he actually (at least it seemed it to me.. sped up)I recovered and got the gate open just in time.. but I never forgot it. Not probably what you were looking for but those are my encounters

Not much,In private once I asked a question,he replied "Hell.I dont know" So for years,I probably said hell I dont know. Other than that i shook his hand a couple of times. I did ask one time in a letter, to talk to him personaly,He never replied,too busy I guess. Shows how old I am as hes been dead for over 24 years.

I suppose that if they tried to reintroduce it, they would be faced with having to recant so much of the *present truth* and *old wine skins* crap. I think also that old wineskins, was a way for lcm to diminish and dismiss any leaders or believers who`s previous experience contradicted him or confronted the idiocy of some of his policies. They would have to admit to being falible, that some of their policies and decisions lacked God`s stamp and approval. I think that they must be terrified to open any door that would allow folks to consider that a leader might make mistakes. Their iron fisted power lay in their requirements of implicit obedience to every leaders whim, because they were in tune with God. It must scare the hell out of them, the idea of people beginning to question, to require accountability.

I can't speak for the captains of illogic at The Way Corporation, but even if one believed that the theology in PFAL was correct, the presentation is definitely dated. Even when I took the class in '78 I thought Wierwille was pretty hokey.

It pretty much already has--Here and at a hundred other sites--Even 99% of the people who once believed it have grown up and seen it for the swiss cheese theology that it is and moved on. It never held water and it certainly hasnt held any water over time. It never was the E=mc2 great revelation to change the world, it was more like a glass of Tang that was empty of any nutrients and had a very short shelf life. If it was released today it would be laughed at as a bizarre relic of a bygone era--I dont extend much to the honchos but they must know that

Maybe they are waiting for the right kind of offer. Some offshoots think every word in it drips gold. da way could retain ownership.. and just sell limited "publishing" rights of sorts.. I'm almost surprised they haven't advertised it on ebay.. but then about ninety five percent of those in offshoots are grads anyway. Legally, they could not be charged again.. maybe that's it. There's just no money in it any more.. there are probably enough illegal copies floating around, that those who wanted one bad enough probably already has one. But I'll admit, it is odd.. where else is the "greatest work" of the "founder" of a group buried like this? look at the scientologists.. it would be like boxing and locking up dianetics and all..

and whoever anonymous member marked down the last post.. lets look at a few facts and reality here.. the numbnuts down south failed to "get a life".. perhaps one or more did..but what happened? Now their little camping "adventure" is cloaked in darkness.. why? It wouldn't survive the light of day.. feel free to disagree all you want..

I don't know. It sounds like they might have been a couple of butt heads before they ever heard about The Way. But, that's part of the problem with this doctrine of "special entitlement" that TWI promotes. It gives people like this a license to follow their pre-existing inclinations without a sense of guilt. I suppose one could apply this same logic to other types of unacceptable behaviors that were rationalized in TWI. They used convoluted reasoning that stemmed from a sense of being "the chosen ones". Just my opinion

Apparently so.

Thank you and welcome to the cafe, someone will probably treat you to a cup of something soon. I would but I have no talent in graphic whatchacallit stuff. I'll just dance in hopes that your arrival here is a good thing for you. I appreciated your kind words of encouragement, comfort and another's experience. Thank you, to you, for being a good friend to the woman you mentioned, it might never be known to you how much you provided. When Moynihan and others were so ugly hearted to me and my children and my husband's memory, I understood they were wrong, thankfully. And I certainly never wish that kind of loss on even him, much less such lack of spiritual assistance and only harm and hurt to his heart. We've come around to a new normal, it's been 12 years since this loss and we're great. And the poor oversight of us is an additional loss in the lives of some leadership. Hang out here and continue to share with us as you'd like, I look forward to reading further. :)

I've been thinking about what Shellon wrote. I'm so sorry you and your kids and family were treated like that. Loss is hard enough in itself. But to have the people closest to you blame you is unthinkable. A therapist once told a friend of mine that she was having irrational thinking, because she was feeling guilty about her husband's death. He had been ill for a long time before he died. After he died she kept going back and forth between thinking maybe she didn't do enough to find a cure or maybe she let him suffer too long while she hoped for a cure. The therapist told her grief brings on irrational thinking. There was nothing she could have done to change the outcome. After she shared this with me, she asked me to help her when she started experiencing irrational thinking again. She would sometimes call in the middle of the night, and all I had to do was remind her how much she loved her husband, how much he loved her and he knew she did everything she could for him. That's all it took for her to get peaceful again. When she would go through this, it was as if she was being tortured. It's now four years later and she is doing very well. She is happy and healthy and even dating. But it took over two years for her to get healed. I honestly believe that if someone had tried to blame her or play that kind of a mind game on her, she would not have survived it. The therapist was right. It's irrational to blame ourselves or someone else for a death. It's part of the cycle of life. God can heal and deliver, I would never want to give up on believing that. I'll believe that until someone takes their last breath. But when it's done, we just have to help each other heal and love each other. No need for a "spiritual" autopsy. Shellon, you seem like a very strong person to have survived all that and to be in contact with the relatives. You probably understand how to really help people the way they truly need to be helped. I think the reason leaders blamed people so much is because they were terrible at their jobs. They had no clue how to minister to people. They liked to tout themselves as being a MOG with us knowing the truth greater than it had ever been known before blah blah blah. They should have known better than anyone how to minister. But for all their ego and holier than thou lectures, the were incompetant and inept. That's why they blamed.

Come on Bolshevik - cough up - we need some fresh dirt to dig through around here.