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Of all the... You know what's dangerously close to cultism? Denying what the experts in a given field say because you read an old piece of literature that convinces you that you know better. Contrarianism, the belief that an iconoclastic view must be the correct view. THAT'S cultism. The rejection of expertise in favor of "special knowledge." That's cultism.

Thanks Allan......for stating your position. THiS is what a *discussion forum* is all about. Something that twi NEVER allowed.

It is my understanding people used to not get on elevators that didn't have an operator. They were uncomfortable with the idea technology would work at the push of a button and keep them safe. They chose the stairs. But elevator operators are rare now, and I don't know anyone with such a fear. It is also going to be hard to convince folks cars drive safer without a person behind the wheel. New technology will dominate the roads someday. That may not feel right. But it is logical. The idea that vaccines and other medical technology will increasingly be created at faster rates may feel weird too.

You're still missing the point, Allan. 1.) Children with the virus are vectors. They spread the disease to others who can suffer severe disease and death. Remember Typhoid Mary? She unknowingly infected 53 people. Three of them died. She, herself, was asymptomatic. 2.) Children can appear to be unaffected, only to develop MIS-C weeks later. If left untreated, it can be life threatening. No one wants to knowingly subject their kids to that possibility. 3.) The risks you can face from getting the disease are greater than the risks from the vaccine. Pericarditis is a good example. Your chance of developing pericarditis from the disease, itself, is several times higher than from the vaccine. All the vaccine does is teach the body's immune system what the virus looks like so when it sees it, it can launch an immune response. Your immune system does the heavy lifting, not the vaccine. You are correct when you say we don't know how long your immune system will fight off infection. Not enough time has passed to really know yet. Immunity is multifaceted. When your body senses a foreign substance (virus), it begins to produce antibodies. Our bodies encounter foreign invaders all the time so they are constantly producing some form or other of antibodies. They are too numerous for your body to retain on a long term basis. That's why efficacy wanes. There is good news, though. Once your immune system knows what a particular virus looks like, it starts producing special cells (T-Cells and B-Cells) that are specifically tasked with sensing the presence of invaders and subsequently making a new batch of antibodies. People who were infected with SARS-1 in 2003 have long since lost any antibodies they developed. Recent tests, however, have revealed they still have at least some T and B cells, 18 years after the fact. SARS-1 is similar to the current SARS-2 that is causing Covid. With that in mind, it's reasonable to assume that some T and B cells for SARS-2 may last for years, as well. We don't know that for a fact, though, because not enough time has passed. In the meantime we can use the vaccine to tell the body to make T and B cells and keep the arsenal full just in case .

Just saw this so I am late to the party again. I tend to check just certain sections and don't often venture into open. I will donate tomorrow as I am in bed and wallet is downstairs. Mods feel free to send me a reminder as this older brain forgets stuff a lot! Thanks to everyone who keeps the coffee, Danish, discussions and lights on here at the cafe.

I'm thinking (not saying) that the hysteria and rhetoric around it and the 'group think' is resoundingly close to cultism.

1/Your 'perceiving' of my reasoning is incorrect actually. I don't believe I said "my God-given immune system is sufficient to protect me" My POV is that I'll 'run with what I've got' and not put made up suff into my body...at this stage anyways. 2/ I also did not 'infer' as is your 'assumption' that my God-given immune system would not stop me passing on the virus (neither does the covid jab btw) 3/ I am also not 'pushing my POV', you guys are, I'm not pushing anything except my thoughts/beliefs on what I am doing. Have I told ANYONE to NOT get the jab ? vs you and others telling me I should !

Nope ! not going to another Rock of Ages ever again. I’m free !!!!

"Hey kids, remember how we used to be able to sit cross-legged on the cold floor, sing Kumbaya and then get back up without any help? Boy, those were the days, weren't they?"