waysider

"I have a feeling this is brand new learning for most grads. Most tuned out this section of the class and book." What is your basis for that assumption? ------------------------------------------------ "This truly IS the greatest secret in the world today that PFAL (book and magazine form) is THE Bible and is the Word of God in written form." Absolute insanity. Why on Earth would God allow it to be so riddled with errors and inconsistencies if that were the case? ------------------------------------------------- "This knowing how the law of learning operates and how this thing works I came to the conclusion many years ago that for me this Word of God, this Bible--not the King James version, but THE Word of God which was given when holy men of God spake as they were moved by the holy spirit--that this Word of God is my only source for truth outside of the individual seeking." You criticized Mark for using the words "Bible" and "Word of God" interchangeably and yet, here you offer a quote that clearly demonstrates that Wierwille had occasion to do the same thing. ------------------------------------------------ "This is my primary and sole rule for faith and practice. This is why the law of learning operating the way it does and our knowledge of this I have to have some center of reference. For years I read around the Word of God; two, three theological works a week, every week. Because I just love to read and so I read and read and read. Well, these men were all centers of reference for learning and all I got was a hodge-podge of personal conviction but it was basically confusion. Because equally great men regarding the same verse of scripture would contradict each other." Did it ever occur to you that it may have seemed like a "hodge-podge" to him because he kept trying to squeeze things into his narrow frame of acceptance? ------------------------------------------------------- "On a different thread nowIsee asked where does the phrase “only rule for faith and practice” come from. In written form, it was the title of Dr’s very last Magazine article in 1985, but it originated (as far as I know) in the film class Session 7. Here is (with my bold fonts) the 1967 version that we all heard in segment 31 Session 7 of THE CLASS :" It has long been my personal opinion that session #7 was the crucial turning point at which the bait was taken and the hook was set. That's only my opinion but I think this gives that theory some credence ----------------------------------------------------------------------- "So, when I began to understand the operation of the senses in relationship to learning I finally came to the conclusion that instead of staying in confusion with all of men's opinions a lifetime I was willing to come to one point, one center of reference for truth which was outside of the individual seeking and that was THE Word of God. And I've staked my life on the accuracy and the integrity of God's Word. If this Word is wrong then I'm going to be wrong in what I teach. But I'm willing to take that "chance" as you would call it. As John Paul Jones or someone said "he's willing to go down with the ship." I'm willing to go down with the ship." And down he went (in credibility) because he staked his life on what he personally defined as "The Word", ignoring the reality that his take on it was flawed and rife with errors.

Picasso Dora Maar au Chat

Someday I'm gonna be happy But I don't know when just now > > > > > Some day you're gonna be lonely But you won't find me around

What you fear, you will receive-it is a law

I'm not a scientist------nor do I play one on TV. However, if one were to use PFAL as some sort of gold standard of Truth, the snowstorm is busted. There's an axiom in here somewhere, too, but I'm not a mathematician either. Maybe some math person could show the sequence in formulaic format. Somewhere in the PFAL series (don't know where, not inspired to spend my time searching) wierwille states that phenomenon can not be conjured up. In other words, according to the PFAL gold standard being used in this example, one can not tell/ask God for specific phenomenon. Is that Biblically accurate? I don't know. But (and this is crucial) it doesn't matter because PFAL, not the Bible, is being used as the standard of Truth for this argument. So, here we are in 1942. Wierwille tells God to make it snow. His action contradicts the standard that he, himself, has set forth for verification of truth. But it doesn't end there. Suppose it really did snow. That, by virtue of elementary logic, invalidates the section in the PFAL series that taught you can't control phenomenon. Thus, the gold standard has literally exposed its own fallibility. What does all that prove? It proves that, either PFAL is invalid as a standard of Truth, it didn't really snow, or both. I tend to think it proves both.

Believing equals receiving.

My peeve is with service related jobs that require you to say you took a lunch break whether you did or not. (usually not) And then weasel another hour or two a day out of you because they don't approve overtime but would hit the ceiling if you didn't complete the project you are involved in. Don't even bother pointing out the legalities involved.

I think it already did-----figuratively speaking.

The integrity of "The Word" is always at stake. (What the heck does that even mean?)

WARNING!! Off topic for this thread But----- I must interject that I most definitely saw people "kicked out". Early 1970s in Cleveland. Mainly people with mental health difficulties. One young lady (student) was escorted to the door during the "Christ in you" session and told to never, ever return. She openly (and vocally) questioned something that was being taught Was her behavior out of line for group participation?. Probably so, if you use Way standards to gauge appropriateness. But bear in mind that she was mentally ill and seeking help. Leadership claimed she was "possessed", being used by the adversary to disrupt the movement of Gawd's Word. At least 4 or 5 others come to mind as well, though their exits were nowhere near as dramatic as this one.

You did just fine, Roy. Holy hugs to you, Bro.

OK---One more clue. This group later hired future Way believer Barry McCoy to play keyboard before he hooked up with Gary Puckett and The Union Gap.

Sad----Truly sad

I noticed in session three, he scratched his nose 3 times with his right hand at 3 different points during the teaching. I think that means that his words in that session were completely, completely, completely blessed. Shhhhhhh!!------It's a secret. The DaVictster's Code Coming soon to a theater near you.

TVT's!!!! hahahahahaha More like BVD's. Thousands and thousands of people heard wierwille himself say this very thing in multiple formats, in a variety of paramutations. Does the thread have a "written only" disclaimer? Even if he hadn't, the line you quoted in it's place is blatently false as well. "If a man wants to be ignorant, let him be ignorant." hahahahaha

Blast that old context boogaboo! You are using a statement from the session dealing with the bogus "law" of believing. (page 3) Close----but no cigar. Like Mike say, "You gotta master that rascal!"(Paraphrased, of course.)

He got his "revelation" from white supremacy propaganda. His "secrets" were hidden at the bottom of a Drambuie filled coffee mug. All hail the Reverend Dr. Cyclops.

Maybe you could just give us a synopsis.

Mike Posted Today, 12:51 AM Ditto for me, and I'd add that if it weren't for the class and the ORANGE BOOK I'd have never been able to approach the KJV and get as much out of it as I did. --------------------------------------------------------- You might have tried Bullinger's How To Enjoy The Bible. It was readily available long before The "Orange" Book. Here's a free download: http://home.sprynet.com/~dvogel/dvogel.htm

Any two believers can make a marriage work.

"Distraction" is what we were so well conditioned to ignore. (Session 7/ PFAL) Never allow yourself to be "distracted" by rationale and genuine inquiry. Rather, "renew your mind" with a regimen of self delusion exercises. Make a deliberate and systematic practice of anesthetizing the regions of the brain that allow for critical thinking, by means of strange and enticing utterances. And finally, having perfected these things---- STAND. Yes, stand firmly planted in one spot, like a rock that can't be budged, hopelessly immobile, oblivious to the life that ebbs and flows around it. Anything else could result in unspeakable consequences.

80 Proof

No guesses? :(

QUOTE (waysider @ Jan 13 2009, 09:51 AM) * He knew virtually nothing about The Dead Sea Scrolls beyond their very existence. Yet, he passed his personal judgment on them without any real investigation. What is there to document? Very few people knew much about the contents of the scrolls in 1972 or 73 when Wierwille made the statement. Are you saying Wierwille had some sort of privileged access to their contents? I rather doubt that, yet he declared them to be "counterfeit". That, my friend, is a rush to judgment. It's "hasty". Which brings me to the question of what it was that YOU knew about The Dead Sea Scrolls in the 1970s that enabled YOU to deem them "not worth looking at"? Was it because you heard Wierwille say so?

OK---So then the plagiarism must have stemmed from books he acquired AFTER the dump incident.