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Retemories


YIdon'tgotochurch
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Recently, I was talking with my business parnter about getting funding. In the process of setting up the business there are licenses to get and legal fees for contracts. If we stumbled on to a national company,

our business would fail if we got a contract bigger than we were able to handle.

We have friends interested in investing. However one particular friend is dragging his feet. My partner suggested we leave him alone. Putting pressure on this friend to invest would ultimately destroy our friendship.

I agreed and quoted Psalms 37:25.

This had a particularly big impression on my partner that I was able to rattle off a verse by memory. He expressed relief that I had that ability to keep him on the right track. (however, that is not in my job description).

Later, I was thinking of the hundreds of verses I once could quote on demand. Suddenly, I realized, I could not remember the Corps retemory references. i.e. 1-1, through 1-5. I have no doubt that I actually know all 25 verses. I don't remember the reference numbers and its alarming to me.

It's bad enough that after surgeries, I can't remember events the way my wife remembers them. There are numbers and names I may never remember again. I'm not so concerned with being in compliance with TWI's references as much as being able to remember them.

Do any of you remember the reference numbers? I can get the 1st 10 of the white retemories. But not the last 15. None of the Corps retemories.

Age and surgery sure is insane.

I guess I should be thankful to wake up in a new world every day. But some things are reference points. I think I miss them.

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I recall an incident while in residence at Emporia...There were about 500 of us sitting there while LCM was calling on individuals to stand and recite retemories. If you missed even one little preposition in the verse, he would verbally abuse you, screaming at you, belittling and humiliating you in front of hundreds of people. It became a real "fear thing" for many people...

...The actual content of the verse was lost on his demand for gramatical perfection. Twi became so obsessed with gramatical accuracy that the heart of what the verse said became almost meaningless. It became a form of mental masturbation. Memory pegs, retemories, and other "mental excercizes" became a tool to stroke the ego...I also remember when memorizing the "Red Thread" was in vogue...There was no glory to God, it was nothing more than drawing attention to the person's ability to dicipline their mind and then put on a show for their audience.

No...I couldn't tell you a single reference number used by twi retemory cards...and I don't miss them in the least.

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For what it's worth, I don't personally believe GOD ever intended for us to remember scripture in a word-for-word fashion. If he did, in what language would it be? Where would the punctuion go? What would the syntax be? Jesus Christ must have known a tremendous amount of what was in the scrolls and yet how often do we see him speak to people in ways that connect with their hearts and understanding rather than quote "green card # 37". If you remember that a soft answer turns away wrath, does it really matter where it is written? What's important is to act on it and then if you just have to know where it's written grab a concordance sometime. I remember once hearing that Einstein shunned the concept of rote memorization of such things as historic dates and state capitals. He said that's what books are for. He said he preferred to keep his mind uncluttered so he could focus on ideas and concepts. This is a poor paraphrasing at best , but that's the general idea. This is conjecture on my part, but I think what impressed your business partner was that your quote was so pertanent and came from an understanding of what it meant.---------Please take your songbooks now and turn to #----------------

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For what it's worth, I don't personally believe GOD ever intended for us to remember scripture in a word-for-word fashion. If he did, in what language would it be? Where would the punctuion go?

Exactly...Words are nothing more than vehicles to communicate the reality of what those words represent. I believe that God desires for us to "hold concepts" in our minds...to the end that we apply and live those ideas and concepts...that we actually love other people rather than having the ability to quote by memory, the verses with the word "love" in them.

Twi always got caught up in the mechanics of biblical knowledge. Crossing T's and dotting I's are not nearly as important as extending your heart to those in need.

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BRAVO Groucho :eusa_clap:

I don't remember a single one either.

It was fear, fear and nothing but fear to be called upon.

My heart was never into it :(

You know.. the one thing they preached so often about was the one thing they installed in us all.....

Be afraid....Be very afraid :blink:

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I recall an incident while in residence at Emporia...There were about 500 of us sitting there while LCM was calling on individuals to stand and recite retemories. If you missed even one little preposition in the verse, he would verbally abuse you, screaming at you, belittling and humiliating you in front of hundreds of people. It became a real "fear thing" for many people...

...The actual content of the verse was lost on his demand for gramatical perfection. Twi became so obsessed with gramatical accuracy that the heart of what the verse said became almost meaningless.

Matthew 23:23-28.

"23Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

24Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

25Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.

26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

28Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity."

Screaming at people for forgetting the placement of one preposition,

and committing adultery and other sins at the same time.

I think we know what Jesus would have said to that....

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I think the only entire card number/verse/verse reference I remember is 1-1 blue ... Isaiah 26:3 ... about God keeping us in perfect peace when our minds are stayed on Him ... that's the one verse I remember Craig, Dave Bedard, and Pat Powell ranting the most about on Corps Nights at Emporia ... interesting contrast between God's heart for His people (perfect peace) and what we got from some well-meaning, but misguided "leaders" instead, isn't it?

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I also remember the 10th Corps nites when Craig, David and Pat gave us grief for missing a tense on word in a verse.

I do believe it is recorded a few times when Jesus Christ quoted scripture. I always considered that an example better than TWI.

I don't believe it was insignificant to memorize the verses. But that's mho.

As for the heart of the verses memorized, I believe I developed a lot of heart for scripture by memorizing it in my language....English.

A few of us in our fellowships would play a kind of game. When someone said, "VERSE! ! !", the other person would have to quote a reference and verse and could never use the samve verse twice in a day or week. That game became a funny thing after a while if you ran out of verses.

Doglover... Thanks, now that I have 1-1, Isaiah 26:3, I can probably get the rest of the 25 or most of them anyway.

I used verses to get me through LEAD and a number of other events. I'm thankful they pushed me (us) to do it. I grew to actually believe most of those verses deeply. More than the bs of the practical operations of TWI.

Edited by YIdon'tgotochurch
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I recall an incident while in residence at Emporia...There were about 500 of us sitting there while LCM was calling on individuals to stand and recite retemories. If you missed even one little preposition in the verse, he would verbally abuse you, screaming at you, belittling and humiliating you in front of hundreds of people. It became a real "fear thing" for many people...

8th corps residence was only two years earlier and I didnt notice that problem with LCM. Maybe it was partly because GW was more up front in day to day corps operations. I may have silenced him on the subject by a certain "performance" early in the year. I suppose by the time you were in res, LCM was in the process of increasingly taking over things.

I don't believe it was insignificant to memorize the verses. But that's mho.

I wouldnt be surprised ( and he will correct me if I am wrong!) if Groucho would agree with you here. I think his emphasis is on the extremes the idea was carried to.

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Lifted up...No correction needed. :) , I appreciate the value of memorizing verses of scripture, of reading the bible with comprehension and studying the various sections of scripture that are relevant to life's situations...I think it's a good idea for Christians to understand the bible as much as possible.

I was merely illustrating how twi went overboard with their nazi-like approach to "Christian education"...

To me, being a living epistle is not having the ability to recite the bible by rote but to incorporate the qualities of Christian thought and behavior into one's life...but of course, knowing the scriptures is an important part of doing that....

...peace :)

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John 3:16. I don't know about it being a retemory, but it's in the class -- forgodsolovedtheworld -- when he's dealing with uncials and cursives.

I have been working to understand this (as in stand under it) for 34 years -- since I set in pfal.

It's as mysterious to me now as it was then.

It's always good for a laugh, though.

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How many different sets of retemories did we have to memorize? I remember Word in Business, BLEAD, Whites, Corps, and wasn't there a WOW set?

I used to memorize them because it was a challenge for me and I seemed to be able to hold many in my grey matter, but alas, once the great Forehead called me and I missed a word. I was then dissected, put under a microscope and given an enema while standing up before a corps night. Oh it was fun..

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We had a set for every class of craig's - WAP - Foundational, Intermediate & Advanced, Defeating the Adversary, Way Disciples had their own, each fellowship tried to have their own, too.

I have a terrible memory for things that I honestly see no value in memorizing scripture and other stuff you can look up somewhere (at least, I think that's the case, because some things I am very good at remembering). I despised them forcing us to memorize scriptures and definitions of things like SIT, Interpretation, etc... Especially craig's long, drawn out, long-winded, big worded definitions.

Craig and my ex have photographic memories and can look at something once and remember every minute detail of it, no matter what it is. Having a husband like that made it even worse for me..... I called my ex a "walking Bible". Nowadays, though, I'm surprised at how many scripture I have retained. I attribute it to the rote repitition - I mean, how could you not memorize some of the scriptures the way they were in every - single - teaching over and over and over and over again?

Heck, even Einstein said, "Why memorize what you can look up?"

Edited by Belle
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Add to that list, Dealing With The Adversary(DWA). I think they were green. When I was studying for a license in a building trade, we had to be able to cite code word for word. Once you had your license,though, noone really cared if it was "Section 145; yada yada yada" . The proof of your comprehension was in the finished product. There are lots and lots of tradesmen who can turn out top notch work without quoting the code book but I'll bet they can find it in the book if the need arrises.

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Retemories? Don't you find it interesting ... that while we were required to recite every single word just as it was written in the King James ... leadership could do something so "creative" as to INVENT the word "retemorie"? It's not in the dictionary. It's just another piece of WaySpeak.

And while we're on the topic of memorizing verses, does anyone know a verse that addresses the tendency of some to take advantage of others, and then to take their help for granted? Being the Bible quote expert in my circle of non-Wafer friends, I was asked this recently, and couldn't come up with a verse.

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Mat 15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with [their] lips; but their heart is far from me.

Mar 7:6 He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with [their] lips, but their heart is far from me.

Isa 29:13 Wherefore the Lord said, Forasmuch as this people draw near [me] with their mouth, and with their lips do honour me, but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:

???

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Retemories? Don't you find it interesting ... that while we were required to recite every single word just as it was written in the King James ... leadership could do something so "creative" as to INVENT the word "retemorie"? ...

The word retemory was indeed TWI terminology, but I'm not sure it was a term "invented" by TWI leadership, or something a Way believer coined at one time and the term just seemed to stick. LCM explained the meaning of the term as to: "retain scripture in the memory" which would make one think it was a term invented by TWI leadership. Unfortunately many people retained scriptures in their memory only as an opportunity to jump down your back whenever you crossed the party line.

I don't think there's anything wrong with retaining scripture in your memory per se. It all depends on the purpose it is ultimately going to be used for that makes it right or wrong. Job's "miserable comforter's" retained scriptures word perfect in their memory as well. But when Jesus Christ was ministering to others however, "He found the place where it was written." I think that's all one need's to know as to where the proper emphasis should be put.

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Retemory is not an actual word? I'm shocked! And to think I have been using it these 20 odd years to no avail.........Speaking of Corps night, etc., remember we sat alphabetically? Because of my last name, I sat smack in front of the podium (darn my parents!) and let me tell you the horror it was. I can remember the shaking and sweating and deals I made with God, etc, etc, etc............I NEVER once got called on, but I can tell you this much, after those introductory 'abuse sessions' I couldn't tell you what any teaching was about. I think I blacked out during the rest of the time in upstairs Wierwille. I honestly think if you could live thru that, you could live thru anything...........I work in hte corporate world and I am able to meet with CEO's, Senior VP's, etc, and be fine because I think nothin would terrify me as much as those days.........Just my opinion.

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I was pretty good with retemories. I have a desent memory so that helps. I remember it being much more of an issue in my early years. In the corps it was a huge deal, even for us mini and junior corps. After the AC I don't remember retemories being that big of a deal except during certain classes. Even then it wasn't pushed the way I remember it earlier. Perhaps it was the further we got away from the corps the less it was inforced.

I still remember many of them, minus what color and number it was. My wife is always amazed that I can rattle them off. It usually comes up when I am explaining something about twi doctrine or if she has a quote book with verses in it she will test me. I usually do really well with those books.

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Retemories? Don't you find it interesting ... that while we were required to recite every single word just as it was written in the King James ... leadership could do something so "creative" as to INVENT the word "retemorie"? It's not in the dictionary. It's just another piece of WaySpeak.

Even one of the syllabi I have from something admitted it was a portmanteau

(not that they said that name, not knowing WHAT a portmanteau WAS)

combining the words "retain" and "memorize".

What it WAS, was a memorizing, but someone felt the need to make up a new word,

as if it was a new idea or a new concept. As others have pointed out, adding new

organization-specific names and terms help to thicken the wall between

"us" and "them" for those IN the organization.

And while we're on the topic of memorizing verses, does anyone know a verse that addresses the tendency of some to take advantage of others, and then to take their help for granted? Being the Bible quote expert in my circle of non-Wafer friends, I was asked this recently, and couldn't come up with a verse.

Hm. Depends on the specific direction you're going.

You MIGHT apply

Matthew 23:13-15

"13But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

14Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

15Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves."

or possibly Matthew 23:23-24

"23Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

24Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel."

or possibly Matthew 23: 3-5

"3All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

4For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.

5But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,"

Or maybe something else.

Seems like Matthew 23 might be a useful chapter to review for that.

"

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