You Don't Know Me

[Shellon]

This morning my teenager heard me give her instruction on what I needed her to do this afternoon, I said it to her face. Because she's mine and I think she's very funny, it struck me when she said "you don't know me". Sometimes she says "you're not the boss of me" but the point is she knows which she can 'get away with' and when.

I don't wish to discuss my daughter here, I just wanted that as intro to our own reality; we don't know each other, most of us at all, not even a little bit.

I know a few posters here enough to say in jest 'you don't know me', having full knowledge that yes, you do know me and get me, understand what I say and how in the hell I mean it. That's an extra bonus when I don't even really know for sure what I meant.

We judge, we assign, we assume, we label, we stereotype, we pigeonhole (I don't really understand that one but the list needed one more) and we think we know a poster here by their words typed on a screen. In fact, it's extremely difficult, even on a really good day, to really know.

If my morning with my teenager were not at pleasant and I come to GSC and bark at the readers here, do you know I am out of sorts cuz I live with a teenage daughter? Not unless I say so, nope.

If I have a disagreement with my boss and need to blow somewhere, GSC might be a great place to unload. And you might read my words and wonder what the hell got into me to make me so surly. Actually I'm the boss, so that disagreement could be weird, but you didn't know that til I told ya, huh?

I've been hanging out in this joint for 11 years (waydale before here). O M G........

My point in admitting that is to understand that many of you have chatted with me, read my stuff here or in my blog, heard about me. A few have been in my home, been trusted with my children, feel comfortable talking to me on the phone. You would understand and say "I know you" and know from whence I'm coming in a post.

Online communities are interesting and strange and sometimes frightening places that we have to make a choice about every day. No eye contact, body language, voice influx. We have to meet each other where it appears we are today and not get constipated if we might not be where we were yesterday.

If I tell you I've been sexually assaulted in my life in a thread here, do you believe me? You don't have to, no. If you choose to believe me then we can share dialogue and perhaps, hopefully educate and help each other.

If you tell me you've been in a car accident, I can't see your injuries, I can't hear pain in your voice. I will pray with and for you and offer whatever assist I might from such a distance in such a faceless manner.

Trust is a scary journey.

Edited October 2, 2009 by Shellon

[Twinky]

One day we shall know as we are known...slightly scary prospect.

One day all hurt and pain will be washed away.

Till then, we need to show a little (okay, a lot) of compassion and kindness. We all have a few hurts. We all have off days. And (like it or not0 we all need someone to be sympathetic, kind, once in a while.

[Watered Garden]

Yeah. Trust is a scary thing with people you do see face to face. That probably is why there are two entities I know I can trust; one I do know face to face and the Other I don't, yet.

WG

[Shellon]

Yes, WG, I understand the trusting of one primarily. That feeling of that one person having my back no matter what, understanding me even if I'm not understandable. Also and maybe as wonderful is that trust including that one having the strength to say "sheesh, who shat in your oatmeal" but then staying around long enough to hear the answer.

So, yes, there can be someone who does know us. Those relationships come with time and communication and maintenance and I do happen to be blessed with that kind of relationship.

My daughters know me, mostly, and I trust them within reason to consider lovingly what I've said or done. But that's come only with 27 years of time and blood and sweat and tears.

In a forum such as this it does behoove us to read and maybe read again and consider before we just react. Maybe ask more questions, maybe remain open ended for a time.

Remember TWI used to teach that no one knows our heart except God and I think they might have added that we, ourselves, know our own hearts. But I'd agree with them that, indeed, our hearts can not be fully known by another unless we consider more than just what is obvious or apparent, be willing to do some back and forth and trust enough to be honest.

I asked my maternal grandmother once about the Bible; what was all that and am I supposed to do anything. She said the only one I needed to concern myself with was doing unto others as I wished them to do unto me.

Now, 50 years of life has taught me well that it's not nearly that simple, really, even if applicable. But she had the basic information correct.

Even in a faceless forum with no eye contact, no body language, no voice?

Yes

[George Aar]

Trust is a scary journey.

And one that is often not worth taking...

[Shellon]

You're right, George, often it's not.

But, sometimes it is and it happens every day here as long as GSC is open and operating for us to use. We have to trust our words, sometimes vital information, often the specific details of our lives.

With people we really don't know.......

[waysider]

On the other hand, sometimes I feel like I can express myself more accurately without all the confusing body language and peripheral distractions.

[geisha779]

Shellon,

We had some serious boundary issues in TWI. . . . they translated into many areas of our lives. . and instead of seeking the proper help like a counselor, doctor, or trained pastor we went to each other and sought our help" in house". . . . many times to our extreme detriment.

So, if I am uncomfortable with someone approaching me here with personal issues and problems and them seeking my guidance. . . . I have NO problem telling them. . . I don't know you. . you don't know me. . . . I can't help you. . . . here is where you need to look for assistance. I have pretty much said those exact words. I am not a counselor. . . . I am a historian. . . . big difference.

Boundaries are important. It can be good to be cautious.

On the other hand, I have read certain posters, been intrigued, and have respected the way they handle themselves enough to share personal info with them. . . . some I really like I am friends with on Facebook and speak to on the phone. . . . or at least play pone tag with. :)

I feel I have gained from these experiences. . . .even though our worldviews may vastly differ. . . . I know some very good people a little bit better. There are even people here who post. . . . . . . we knew quite well in TWI.

Maybe trust with the proper boundaries is a good approach?

Edited October 3, 2009 by geisha779

[Shellon]

Waysider and geisha, oh hell yeah, I agree that those boundaries are VERY good, very good indeed.

No way do I suggest that we should all be pals and buddies; that'd never fit someone like me. I like the faceless interaction, the 'you don't know me' most of the time.

My point is that we can't really know what is behind one's post, what's going on in their personal life, just as it should be.

I understand that if I read something posted, I can or can't jump to conclusions or assume. If Bowtwi, for instance, says something here, I've known her for 10 years, and I can feel pretty comfortable knowing exactly what she means. But we've met, trusted each other and share a friendship that is strong. If her post seems like she's piszed off, I know if she really is or just appears to be. Then I don't have to wonder.

For the most part, yes, the boundaries are exactly as they should be. The majority of us have only one thing in common and it's more than enough.

[Watered Garden]

"shat?" is that Old English or Anglo-Saxon?

Seriously, it's probably Anglo-Saxon.

Funny, though!

[T-Bone]

Waysider and geisha, oh hell yeah, I agree that those boundaries are VERY good, very good indeed.

No way do I suggest that we should all be pals and buddies; that'd never fit someone like me. I like the faceless interaction, the 'you don't know me' most of the time.

My point is that we can't really know what is behind one's post, what's going on in their personal life, just as it should be.

I understand that if I read something posted, I can or can't jump to conclusions or assume. If Bowtwi, for instance, says something here, I've known her for 10 years, and I can feel pretty comfortable knowing exactly what she means. But we've met, trusted each other and share a friendship that is strong. If her post seems like she's piszed off, I know if she really is or just appears to be. Then I don't have to wonder.

For the most part, yes, the boundaries are exactly as they should be. The majority of us have only one thing in common and it's more than enough.

yup

[Shellon]

"shat?" is that Old English or Anglo-Saxon?

Seriously, it's probably Anglo-Saxon.

Funny, though!

LOL Watered Garden, it's past tense for poop but we can't say shi...poop here.

HA!

www.shellonnorth.com

Edited October 3, 2009 by Shellon

[GeorgeStGeorge]

yup

You'll have to forgive T-Bone. He has this habit of rambling on and on...

George

[AHAT4JC]

Amen sister!!!!Oh and BTW I've missed you!!!

[Shellon]

I've missed you too ~! How are things? We really need to catch up, huh?

[T-Bone]

You'll have to forgive T-Bone. He has this habit of rambling on and on...

George

Dang! It's always something at this joint. No matter what you say - somebody has got to pick it apart.

[Oakspear]

In an on-line, words-on-the-page community as this one is, it behooves us to think for more than a nanosecond before hitting the 'reply' button, but even then, misunderstandings and assumptions abound.

One of my personal 'words of wisdom' is that I have the responsibility to express myself in a manner that is easy to understand and that isn't rude or abrasive while the person that I am addressing has the responsibility to refrain from thinking the worst or picking the most negative connotation when I am perceived as ambiguous.

Wow! should write that down somewhere

[waterbuffalo]

One day we shall know as we are known...slightly scary prospect.

One day all hurt and pain will be washed away.

Till then, we need to show a little (okay, a lot) of compassion and kindness. We all have a few hurts. We all have off days. And (like it or not0 we all need someone to be sympathetic, kind, once in a while.

Those are sweet thoughts, Twinkie :)Thank you!

[Bramble]

Sometimes-SOMETIMES-you engage with someone on the internet only to realize the other person has big issues. Using a net id and email not related to your real life can be a good thing. because you don't know who is on the other side of the online personality or what they are capable of or what they really want.

[Shellon]

Yes, Bramble, and therein lies the good part of it all. The not knowing offers a certain amount of comfort and convenience whatever the situation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GcVnhNjWV0

Edited October 10, 2009 by Shellon

[Shellon]

I'm struck by how we have to trust. If you and I are going south on our 127 highway here and I choose to pass you, I have to trust that you're going to notice my actions, not cut to your left in front of me and you have to trust that I'm going to complete the entire passing before I return right and we go along on our merry ways.

I might never meet you in person, I might never know you, but I've chosen, at that moment, to trust you. And if I'm on 127 south, I've got my daughter with me, thereby changing the trust to a higher level of need.

I went to my Chiropractor this morning and mentioned that I'd been in a roll over accident about 4 years ago and he was none to happy that I hadn't mentioned that before in his intake information to treat me.

Was it because I didn't trust him with the information? Was it because I forgot?

Yes, and my reasoning made perfect sense to me. But of people in my world that I might do well to trust with such trauma, it would certainly be him.

Here we trust each other with TWI stuff, some daily understanding and learning, maybe a peek of private.

We learn what works for us, specifically, and what doesn't, but we get to choose.

[JeffSjo]

I think that I often look to be able to trust folks in general.

But considering how my former splinter group ended up twisting every bit of personal info. they had on me and tried to use it against me and often behind my back I understand that trusting somebody with personal info. is risky.

But most often I guess I use some kind of risk/benefit analysis. Now at least I KNOW THE RISKS, and I can still look for the rewards of intimacy.

[Shellon]

Jeff, thinking about your post and reading it several times, it took me a little while to understand and finally get to the place where you said you can "at least know the risks" and then make your decisions.

That's a good point and due consideration given where we've all been and why we ended up there. Or here, or over there....

For me, personally, the stuff I ended up in that took me to place(s) of lack of trust weren't without my own accountability and I accept that, even 15 years in The Way Ministry.

So, having said that and understanding your point, I agree that we can take from those experiences and carry the learning into new and hopefully better instances, circumstances and experiences and follow the 'fool me once, shame on you...' standards.

For me, it's an almost daily healthy practice to remember how much something hurt or recall how much I invested before I found the exit door. But that isn't without it's benefits too, eh?

I'm also reminded that it's not just me who has to be cautious, but to remember that I, too, have to prove myself and that should be acceptable too.

If I want others to know me, trust me, invest their emotions, perhaps.

:)

Edited October 13, 2009 by Shellon

[JeffSjo]

That sounds about right to me Shellon.

In many ways I think all of us can relate to these things in some manner after our time in TWI.

But even if TWI hadn't have been our particular brand of poison we'd still be dealing with some of the same issues perhaps.

I mean if I say,"He lies all the time in order to get people to buy into his crapola" it seems reasonable to me that most people would think of someone other than TWI or my former splinter group leadership.

[Shellon]

Oh hell yeah, no doubt. It's not all about TWI and in fact, for me personally, TWI is minimal on the list of "crapola" I bought under the trust umbrella.

It was but one of the poisons. What I understand, now, is that I can and should trust. Everyone, no. Everything, no. All the time, no.

It's a process of knowing and understanding and gaining control over what we allow. That is the pleasure part for me.

I get to choose and I love realizing that it's ok for me to choose, freely.