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skyrider

Bad Decisions: The Way to Blunder Onward

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This topic, from Wierwille the Patriarch thread.....

......[Geer's Passing of a Patriarch paper] "The final Way Corps location was not at all what we had anticipated. It is located in an area that is far removed from easily accessible transportation. It is also in a very difficult part of the British Isles to facilitate business needs, and perhaps worst of all, it is isolated from any large groups of believers. Our primary choice in England would have had good transportation, easy access to businesses that we had long dealt with and been close to a majority of the believers in Britain as well as being far more accessible to the majority of European believers."

The blundering onward of bad decisions......1) Gartmore was far removed from easily

accessible transportation, 2) it was very difficult to facilitate business needs,

and 3) it was isolated from any large groups of believers.

So, this was NOT AT ALL what geer and leadership had anticipated....er, believed for.

What? Geer failed the most basic of pfal-premises??? Needs and wants must be parallel.

The things that Geer NEEDED and WANTED were not parallel, or consistent, to sound principles

of business and/or impacting culture with the Word.

The Church Epistles DOCUMENT epicenters of outreach in cities like Rome, Corinth, Ephesus, etc.

Why would you move to an isolated area.....somewhat removed from people and commerce?

What objectives did you embrace [or violate] to arrive at this juncture?

....[POP paper quote] "We had lost the original location in England that we had selected because our own Way Corps graduates were not capable of handling things involved in getting a location. They just collapsed under the pressure. The increased difficulty in doing business in a remoter area of Scotland made me glad to have the extra time to prepare for Dr. and Mrs. Wierwille's visit."

Why were corps grads put in charge of "getting a location?" Who sends in underlings

to do MAJOR decisions and/or negotiating? And, notice....how quick Geer is to blame others.

NEVER FORGET THAT. It is the modus operandi of vpw and co.

Remember....corps were blamed for not stopping the rain at corps week.

....[POP paper] "There were massive things that needed attention immediately upon our moving in. There had been very little maintenance to the roofs and gutters and as a result there was considerable leakage in any event of rain."

1)Massive things that needed attention immediately.

2) Roofs, gutters, leakage needed maintenance.

WOW......who missed all these details?

Who blundered onward with more blunders piling up?

....[POP paper] "There was almost no hot water and the heating was very poor. We either froze or boiled, and if we boiled we did it at a great cost. There was so little hot water in fact that for quite a while we used the showers adjacent to the large gymnasium in the Knox Centre to shower, which meant walking across the centre of the campus in robes and towels in the wintertime. "

OMG.....detail, after detail. Geer's paper is A PUBLIC ADMISSION for all to see

that these people have no credibility to lead others!! NONE.

And.....this is supposed to be a "training center for leadership?"

....[POP paper] "When we accepted the decision to locate the Corps in Scotland, we had to evaluate whether Chris and Nancy Kent could handle the United Kingdom from Scotland or whether they would have to stay in Altrincham to be central to the country. Finally we decided that with the percentage of our work that was in the southern part of the country it was too much to tack on the additional drive to get to Manchester, let alone from there to the south coast. It became evident that for the work of the Ministry it would be more expedient to leave them in Altrincham. That left us without the man whom we had felt could handle our Way Builders and without Nancy whom we had thought would have been able to handle our bookkeeping."

The blunders keep piling up....all because of THE DECISION TO LOCATE AT GARTMORE.

Now, they've got to figure out logistics of leadership, personnel, et al.

Heck, it's what UPS or FedEx people DO on a daily basis.

Geer and his bumbling buffoons have NO BUSINESS trying to lead others.

And, this is the guy who set up all kinds of franchises for his classes??

:biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/>

Okay, One More....just to emphasize Blundering Onward

....[POP paper] "When we moved into the facility, there was one telephone which worked only sporadically. We had selected a telephone system to replace the single wall phone that existed upon arrival, but due to the costs involved and other factors we had decided to run all the internal cables ourselves."

One. Telephone. That. Worked. Only. Sporadically.

OMG.....I can't stop laughing. :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/>

.

Edited by skyrider
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This same BLUNDERING OF BAD DECISIONS applies to Camp Gunnison.....imo.

Disadvantages of Sleepy Hollow....later, Camp Gunnison

1) Isolation from major arteries of commerce/people

2) Cabins were old and run down

3) Building and maintenance costs

4) Corps traveled thru icy conditions and treacherous overpass

5) Resupplying kitchen/food items was constant

6) No involvement with the town folk

7) Beautiful scenery, but not allowed to partake

8) Bless Patrol thru the freezing nights

Advantages of Camp Gunnison

1) A good financial investment

2) Near elk hunting areas (for trustees)

3) More work areas (besides weed pulling in Emporia)

4) Free labor from inrez corps....immeasurably significant

5) Isolation for mogs to be with young corps girls

Yeah, sure....I enjoyed the wide, open Rocky Mountain High scenery and all.

But when I was there in 1980-81.....we weren't allowed to enjoy/explore much.

Too many classes, too much busy work.

Weighed in the balances, I've always viewed Camp Gunnison as BAD DECISION-MAKING.

For the corps, the little guy.....it only added to the burden of one's training,

i.e. more distance to travel, more gas expense, car maintenance, snow tires & chains,

more risk in traveling, etc.

And, now.....how'd that Camp Gunnysack decision work out?

That corps training location CLOSED DOWN as well.

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....[POP paper] "When we moved into the facility, there was one telephone which worked only sporadically. We had selected a telephone system to replace the single wall phone that existed upon arrival, but due to the costs involved and other factors we had decided to run all the internal cables ourselves."

Admission: sheer miserliness.

Other factors: Chris K was an electrician. CG probably thought he could demand of CK that he do it free of charge. Of his own free will, of course.

When you buy something run-down - you have to budget upgrade costs into the price you pay.

Admission: didn't know how to budget.

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....[POP paper] "There were massive things that needed attention immediately upon our moving in. There had been very little maintenance to the roofs and gutters and as a result there was considerable leakage in any event of rain."

1)Massive things that needed attention immediately.

2) Roofs, gutters, leakage needed maintenance.

WOW......who missed all these details?

Who blundered onward with more blunders piling up?

That's why a prudent purchaser always purchases "subject to survey" or gets a survey before committing irrevocably to the purchase. Following the survey, the purchaser can (a) go ahead if the survey doesn't reveal anything costly to repair; (b) negotiate a reduction on account of necessary repairs; © withdraw from the proposed purchase.

Either : (a) the leaks should have been known about in advance and the repair cost deducted from (negotiated off) the purchase price (and the price saving immediately utilised to carry out the essential repairs); or (b) no survey was done...which would have been very poor stewardship of the money.

If you know these are the problems (because you've had a property survey done), why whinge about what needs to be done?

Anyway...probably what caused the holes in the roof was CG's massive ego. It wouldn't fit into a building that size, LOL.

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For anyone who's interested, this is the place nowadays: Gartmore House

The countryside is still fabulous.

The place is much better than when I'd been - but then, it had only just been purchased and needed a lot of doing up.

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Geer claimed that the reason they didn't get the "primary choice in England" was

"We had lost the original location in England that we had selected because our own Way Corps graduates were not capable of handling things involved in getting a location. They just collapsed under the pressure."

It's a typical, vague excuse for an explanation just like vpw used to do.

When the first way corps refused to fully worship and kow-tow to vpw,

he kicked them all out and claimed they didn't get it together, either.

Getting back to the main point, it was very poor planning, and bad business,

for vpw or geer to sign off on a location with even HALF the liabilities this one

was said to offer, without any easy method to correct them. It's obvious

that business went on as usual from their previous location, while geer went

off by himself, to a remote location, with a need for complete refurbishment of

the infrastructure and upgrades for insufficient systems- for water, for heating,

for telephone service. He proceeded to try to do it all with insufficient support,

insufficient personnel, and insufficient time, and had the nerve to try to use

the UNFINISHED, UNDERSTAFFED facility for all sorts of events, and was stressed

because he had to do it all himself.

"When we lost our initial location, time was short, so it required extreme effort to locate and evaluate other available properties. Even though we needed to move quickly, careful evaluation was required so that we would not find ourselves in a bind legally or caught in a bad business deal. This meant learning the legal considerations which differed from England to Scotland after having recently learned the English. Once acquisition was made, there was a voluminous amount of work to do in stocking the location so that we could begin to operate."

All of that was POOR PLANNING. Would the entire ministry collapse if they'd done things

as they'd been doing them for another year or so while they actually found a satisfactory

location and worked on THAT with sufficient numbers of people? I suspect it might have

been fully ready much sooner despite being acquired later. They WANTED to move quickly,

and CHOSE to move quickly rather than act when the time was right and not just because

they wanted to act NOW. It's obvious that rushing into this meant roadblock after

roadblock, and, frankly, it was his own fault that it went that way.

"Once we had done that, we had another problem, that of the platemaker. The platemaker that we had been using in Altrincham had broken just prior to our coming to Scotland. It was, in fact, an old, very slow platemaker that we had gotten secondhand, so we took in a photocopier that was meant to make direct-image offset masters. This deal on the photocopier which we entered into very shortly after the New Year's period turned out to be the one that taught us how difficult it is to trade in Scotland, and especially how difficult it is being an American. The issue of the photocopier/platemaker never really did get resolved and in the end we had to buy an Addressograph Multigraph platemaker which worked very well. "

twi's poor business practices are on display here. Rush into things,

and-especially- get the least expensive, second-hand version you can find

of things, because it's smarter business to try to keep it running and save

money on the purchase than to buy something new and maintain it when

in use. Again, the problem of rushing into a location-in this case, in

Scotland where all the rules were different and they'd prepared for one

in England- makes things difficult again. It was AVOIDABLE.

"One of the additional disadvantages to having to have a Corps location in Scotland as opposed to England was the need to re-establish business contacts. Every time you have to start over in business it takes time and work to develop good business relations. We had had quite a good reputation among the firms that we traded with regularly in England. When we started over in Scotland, it seemed to be a very challenging adventure because we seemed to be besieged by business "cowboys' out to take advantage of us, and we still had to rely quite heavily on our English contacts to fulfill our needs. "

Need I say it again? They rushed into a bad business decision

so they could brag about having MADE a business decision,

and the results made problem after problem. Geer never had the

intellectual honesty to admit he invited these problems by rushing

into selecting a location that failed to meet their needs, then

exacerbated the problem by rushing everything rather than

having all the work done at a reasonable pace and declaring the

place "under construction" until it was truly ready for use.

" However, during the course of the class it became more and more evident that the quality of the translated works was dubious. The French was clearly deficient and in places quite misleading. The Spanish was not laid out at all in the way that I had seen Dr. Wierwille lay classes out with the attention to detail that he paid. We discovered linguistic problems in both classes as well as inconsistencies in the class layouts, and it took an enormous amount of work to try to keep the classes as a whole on an even keel."

"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure." Why weren't the translations gone over in great detail

years before this class, and corrected as needed long before this setup was being prepared.

If it was really 100% ready, they could have had each language's primary sessions taped ahead of time,

and corrected and re-taped as necessary until each session was satisfactory,

then host those sessions and have live teachers for the small groups?

Too much rushing, too little planning, and small wonder it became an ordeal to run rather than

something that went fairly smoothly. The advance planning was woefully deficient,

and that meant DAMAGE CONTROL at the last minute to cover for it.

That meant a lot of work, and it was the fault of those at the top who failed to plan

sufficiently. What's worse is that this was all predictable- this was for a group whose

primary function is to RUN CLASSES. That they failed to plan these classes correctly

is a serious indictment of people who think they know how to RUN CLASSES.

Geer points out in WW's extracts how difficult it was to get on with things in Scotland. There seems to be a common factor. And that's he himself. His obnoxious style put people off. It was nothing to be with being an American. It was to do with being an obnoxious American.

You folks mostly haven't seen this place. It's in a stunningly beautiful location. Access (for Scotland) wasn't too bad and there is a fast motorway, the M74, going most of the way. It's close to Edinburgh, Glasgow and Falkirk. There are airports nearby (an hour or so away).

The ministry had focussed around the Manchester area. There is a lot of property in the midlands and north of England that might have been suitable, had they chosen to look around. Cheap, in the north of England.

It was a choice to go there. A deliberate decision - there was no need for a last-minute change. Either his ego was suffering badly at not having his own fiefdom (a good word, being as it's Scottish) or he was going to be kicked out of the US ministry anyway. Things between him and LCM were not exactly cordial. That's what prompted the decision. Not that there were no other places available.

And as regards European Corps - nothing anybody else chose would ever have been good enough for him. He demoralised the EC, the believers, trashed the country coordinator ... trashed anybody. You know anything EC might have located (no matter how suitable) would be "defective" because it was all about him!

It seemed they lacked both sufficient Divine Revelation to avoid making

monumentally-bad decisions, and capped that with poor business experience

and poor decision-making skills. That all caught up to them in spades with

the Gartmore acquisition and attempts to make the location work.

It was a beautiful location, but one very poorly-suited for the tasks for

which it was intended.

Same could be said of the Canada Way Corps location in London, Ontario.

That location went belly up when the city got a whiff of twi moving in

and, if I recall, reasserted the zoning ordinances. The corps location

had its fits-and-starts and several European corps had to pack and leave.

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Geer's pop paper......there's a pattern of whining

....[PoP paper] "One of the other problems we faced in putting together the multilingual Advanced Class was the production of the syllabi and other materials for the classes, but I am getting ahead of myself at this point, I really need to go back to the period following our acquisition of Gartmore House."

...."One of the challenges that we were faced with during the European WOW Festival and immediately following it was cooking. To start with we needed to get a kitchen equipped and stocked. Both Barbara and I are experienced at cooking for large groups and at menu preparation, etc. It was largely Barbara who prepared the food for the WOW Festival, and then directly following the Festival I personally began handling the responsibilities of cooking three meals a day."

Etc. etc.

THIS is the whining diatribe that corps were subjected to during the 1986 Corps Week.

Corps had traveled in from all parts of the U.S. -- paying all expenses and using

valuable 'vacation' time from work -- to hear this pity-party blunderfest.

Gee...to put together a multilingual advanced class, you first need the teachers??

Who knew? Or, in other words.......no sh!t Sherlock.

Gee...to pull off the European WOW Festival and subsequent schedule, you have a lot of cooking

to do and you needed to get a kitchen equipped and stocked?

OMG....who woulda thunk it?

THIS type of condescension, as if speaking to third-graders.....is the SAME STUFF

that wierwille would ramble off during those corps nightowls by the fire.

You know, how he worked SO HARD to find the keys to the bible,

and the intense lighting when he filmed the 1967 pfal class,

and working with inept people who wanted to be committed,

and etc. etc.

And, lest we forget......GEER was the man who studied and stood by wierwille's side

incessantly and was, supposedly, "riding in to save The Way Ministry."

:biglaugh:

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In public admission.....blundering point after blundering point.....

Chris Geer CONFIRMS the staggering-ineptness in the corps training.

Chris Geer CONFIRMS the repudiation of wierwille's grandiose agenda.

Chris Geer CONFIRMS the manipulation and exploitation of others on full display.

And....to this day, so many are STILL fooled by his "audacious spirituality."

.......blundering onward, INDEED. :confused:

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I continue to be embarrassed that this guy ever impressed me.

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Raf! CG impressed you?? :confused:/> with what??

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Raf! CG impressed you?? :confused:/>/> with what??

If your image is controlled carefully enough,

and your exposure is limited,

anyone can put forth an impressive facade.

For those of us not allowed behind the curtain,

he could look pretty together.

Even with limited face-time with him and looking

for flaws.

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Geer's pop paper......there's a pattern of whining

....[PoP paper] "One of the other problems we faced in putting together the multilingual Advanced Class was the production of the syllabi and other materials for the classes, but I am getting ahead of myself at this point, I really need to go back to the period following our acquisition of Gartmore House."

...."One of the challenges that we were faced with during the European WOW Festival and immediately following it was cooking. To start with we needed to get a kitchen equipped and stocked. Both Barbara and I are experienced at cooking for large groups and at menu preparation, etc. It was largely Barbara who prepared the food for the WOW Festival, and then directly following the Festival I personally began handling the responsibilities of cooking three meals a day."

Etc. etc.

THIS is the whining diatribe that corps were subjected to during the 1986 Corps Week.

Corps had traveled in from all parts of the U.S. -- paying all expenses and using

valuable 'vacation' time from work -- to hear this pity-party blunderfest.

Gee...to put together a multilingual advanced class, you first need the teachers??

Who knew? Or, in other words.......no sh!t Sherlock.

Gee...to pull off the European WOW Festival and subsequent schedule, you have a lot of cooking

to do and you needed to get a kitchen equipped and stocked?

OMG....who woulda thunk it?

THIS type of condescension, as if speaking to third-graders.....is the SAME STUFF

that wierwille would ramble off during those corps nightowls by the fire.

You know, how he worked SO HARD to find the keys to the bible,

and the intense lighting when he filmed the 1967 pfal class,

and working with inept people who wanted to be committed,

and etc. etc.

And, lest we forget......GEER was the man who studied and stood by wierwille's side

incessantly and was, supposedly, "riding in to save The Way Ministry."

:biglaugh:/>

A TEACHING MINISTRY was unprepared with the teachers and teaching materials

despite the curriculum having been determined years before.

A TEACHING MINISTRY was unprepared with their teaching venue despite having

had the venue ahead of time and it being obvious they either needed more time,

much more onsite workers, or both. This wasn't the first time twi'd run classes

onsite. Since this was an insider to vpw, his complete ineptitude in finding

and securing a site, in rushing and selecting an inappropriate site, in working

with the available personnel to prepare the site, and inability to work with

outsiders (not to mention poor incremental decisions along the way like

"buy old and used and not new and functional" make it obvious they-

and especially he- had no business TRYING to run things.

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A TEACHING MINISTRY was unprepared with the teachers and teaching materials

despite the curriculum having been determined years before.

A TEACHING MINISTRY was unprepared with their teaching venue despite having

had the venue ahead of time and it being obvious they either needed more time,

much more onsite workers, or both. This wasn't the first time twi'd run classes

onsite. Since this was an insider to vpw, his complete ineptitude in finding

and securing a site, in rushing and selecting an inappropriate site, in working

with the available personnel to prepare the site, and inability to work with

outsiders (not to mention poor incremental decisions along the way like

"buy old and used and not new and functional" make it obvious they-

and especially he- had no business TRYING to run things.

.....buy old

.....buy used

.....buy cheap

.....buy run-down

.....use free labor

.....cook all meals

.....bunk the guests

.....guilt guests to work too

THIS is the twi modus operandi.....

Or, in other words.......MONEY, MONEY, MONEY, MONEY, MONEY

Short on money, need money, not enough investment money, fake life till-you-make-it money, etc.

Running on a shoestring and exploitive prayer....

Here's an idea....Have the European WOW Festival at a nice conference location.

Have SOMEONE ELSE provide housing, meals, set-up, clean-up....and then, Geer....YOU TEACH.

Problems-s-s-s SOLVED. :biglaugh:

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.....cook all meals

.....bunk the guests

Why does twi *insist* on this...1) Cook meals, 2) Housing guests, 3) In-house labor

rather than going to a nice conference center or location?

BECAUSE....In-house functions garner strategic advantages.

...1) Twi collects monies for housing/meals for "upfront participation fees"

...2) Free labor or cheap labor helps maximize profits for event

...3) In-house location gives them strategic superiority advantage

...4) Isolation from the outside promotes "believer vs unbeliever" concepts

...5) All imagery enhances that twi-leader is IN CHARGE

...6) Nearby believers will rally to help mow grass, wash dishes, clean bathrooms, etc.

...7) Headquarters [in this case, Gartmore] becomes the FOCAL POINT OF ALLEGIANCE

...8) And.....that's the way wierwille did it.

For reasons listed, that is why GEER WOULD NOT consider alternative options

as suggested above.

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Newlife, it is a lovely location and an impressive big house. Which was run down at the time of TWI purchase. As well as the big house, there was a less pretty functional block the other side of a large parking area. This block housed a gymnasium and several classrooms/ offices. When first purchased, believers came from all over the UK and near-Europe and we slept on camp beds in rows in the gymnasium. There were some showers in the main house but not enough hot water. Nobody cared; we were glad to be there. As the months went by, the place gradually got upgraded.

It was sold off quite a long time ago and became a Christian conference centre. It seems to be in other hands now. No doubt it was sold at a fair profit (having been upgraded). I wonder who got the sale proceeds? Probably not the Way in GB or the Way of the UK or whatever they were calling themselves at that point.

Interestingly I found this website: The Way

and it's NOTHING NEAR that organisation!!!!

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When first purchased, believers came from all over the UK and near-Europe and we slept on camp beds in rows in the gymnasium. There were some showers in the main house but not enough hot water. Nobody cared; we were glad to be there. As the months went by, the place gradually got upgraded.

Same was said.....

....when building the BRC at hq

....when 6th Corps went to Emporia Campus

....when Kansas believers worked weekends at Emporia

....when Camp Gunnison needed upgrades and building projects

....when L.E.A.D. at Tinnie, NM had Way Builders sent in

....when young corps worked 80 hrs weeks to get ready for Rock of Ages

....when Word in Business and Profession Conferences were in your state

....when Advanced Class Specials were in Texas during Thanksgiving weekend

....all of this is standard modus operandi

It was sold off quite a long time ago and became a Christian conference centre. It seems to be in other hands now. No doubt it was sold at a fair profit (having been upgraded). I wonder who got the sale proceeds? Probably not the Way in GB or the Way of the UK or whatever they were calling themselves at that point.

And.......THAT is the point.

Where DID the money go?

WHO pocketed all the money from ALL the FREE labor?

Sure, if you're happy to give......give.

BUT...it is a punch in the gut to realize that SERIAL SEXUAL PREDATION

and EXPLOITATION were part and parcel to the "lying eyes and smiling faces."

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I had never seen a picture of it before.....wow.....that is a huge place. I take it TWI doesn't own it now.

It's a beautiful place. No version of twi nor any splinter group own it now.

The details are both on its website and on its wikipedia page.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gartmore_House

http://www.gartmorehouse.com/about_us/history.html

According to their own site, twi in GB bought it in 1987, according to the wikipedia page,

it was 1985. If it is taken as a given that vpw actually did spend some of his final year of life on-site,

he would have done so in 1985, which means it had to have been used either at the end of 1984

or the beginning of 1985 as cg moved in and began to renovate the site having refused all outside

assistance.

According to both sites, as of 1995, it was vacated by the splinter group, and the history of the site

moved on.

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On 11/18/2014 at 11:26 AM, Raf said:

I continue to be embarrassed that this guy ever impressed me.

I respect Raf's admission. The fact is that ALL of us were conned, at least by Wierwille. Every human is subject to confidence games.

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An old thread, this, but some may have no knowledge, so it may be of interest.

Bear in mind that Gartmore was supposed to be the European HQ.  As such - why seek a place in the farthest north, most remote part?  Scotland isn't at all close to Italy, Germany, other locations.  Not too far from Scandinavia, where there were quite a number of believers, and Ireland, likewise - but England would be just as accessible for those people and MUCH easier for any overland travellers from Europe - and probably cheaper in airfares for those who flew.

Europe has, and had at the time, fantastically good overland networks.  Great rail through many countries, great wide roads and motorways, no border controls once within the area...  You would think somewhere in France or perhaps Germany might be more appropriate.  With a national to lead the ministry.

But HQ was keen to get rid of CG, and a European HQ anywhere other than the UK would require CG to be completely fluent (rather than just "good") in one or more European languages - or rely on interpreters - heck, he wouldn't like that loss of control :evildenk:

Ego.  It was all about his ego.

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I thought Switzerland was suppose to be the European trunk but the country considered TWI a cult, so England was chosen instead with Robert Wilkins? as limb and trunk leader

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so why was Geer chosen as Trunk leader replacement over Wilkins?

 

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"Wilkinson," I think, not Wilkins.

Think it was a way of getting CG out of the hair of the trustees in the USA.

RW was a good guy, but didn't want more responsibility than he already had.  He was trying to run his own business, as well as run his twig, or run the country, as well as doing "voluntary" work for CG.  Eventually he was doing so much that he had to ask Chris to put him on FT paid staff, and had to mothball his business.

I'm not aware of the details, but without warning RW disappeared from view and some new people were designated as country coordinators.  I think maybe that would be at the time the trustees finally put their foot down and M&A'd CG.

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On 11/17/2014 at 8:34 AM, skyrider said:

This topic, from Wierwille the Patriarch thread.....

......[Geer's Passing of a Patriarch paper] "The final Way Corps location was not at all what we had anticipated. It is located in an area that is far removed from easily accessible transportation. It is also in a very difficult part of the British Isles to facilitate business needs, and perhaps worst of all, it is isolated from any large groups of believers. Our primary choice in England would have had good transportation, easy access to businesses that we had long dealt with and been close to a majority of the believers in Britain as well as being far more accessible to the majority of European believers."

The blundering onward of bad decisions......1) Gartmore was far removed from easily

accessible transportation, 2) it was very difficult to facilitate business needs,

and 3) it was isolated from any large groups of believers.

So, this was NOT AT ALL what geer and leadership had anticipated....er, believed for.

What? Geer failed the most basic of pfal-premises??? Needs and wants must be parallel.

The things that Geer NEEDED and WANTED were not parallel, or consistent, to sound principles

of business and/or impacting culture with the Word.

The Church Epistles DOCUMENT epicenters of outreach in cities like Rome, Corinth, Ephesus, etc.

Why would you move to an isolated area.....somewhat removed from people and commerce?

What objectives did you embrace [or violate] to arrive at this juncture?

....[POP paper quote] "We had lost the original location in England that we had selected because our own Way Corps graduates were not capable of handling things involved in getting a location. They just collapsed under the pressure. The increased difficulty in doing business in a remoter area of Scotland made me glad to have the extra time to prepare for Dr. and Mrs. Wierwille's visit."

Why were corps grads put in charge of "getting a location?" Who sends in underlings

to do MAJOR decisions and/or negotiating? And, notice....how quick Geer is to blame others.

NEVER FORGET THAT. It is the modus operandi of vpw and co.

Remember....corps were blamed for not stopping the rain at corps week.

....[POP paper] "There were massive things that needed attention immediately upon our moving in. There had been very little maintenance to the roofs and gutters and as a result there was considerable leakage in any event of rain."

1)Massive things that needed attention immediately.

2) Roofs, gutters, leakage needed maintenance.

WOW......who missed all these details?

Who blundered onward with more blunders piling up?

....[POP paper] "There was almost no hot water and the heating was very poor. We either froze or boiled, and if we boiled we did it at a great cost. There was so little hot water in fact that for quite a while we used the showers adjacent to the large gymnasium in the Knox Centre to shower, which meant walking across the centre of the campus in robes and towels in the wintertime. "

OMG.....detail, after detail. Geer's paper is A PUBLIC ADMISSION for all to see

that these people have no credibility to lead others!! NONE.

And.....this is supposed to be a "training center for leadership?"

....[POP paper] "When we accepted the decision to locate the Corps in Scotland, we had to evaluate whether Chris and Nancy Kent could handle the United Kingdom from Scotland or whether they would have to stay in Altrincham to be central to the country. Finally we decided that with the percentage of our work that was in the southern part of the country it was too much to tack on the additional drive to get to Manchester, let alone from there to the south coast. It became evident that for the work of the Ministry it would be more expedient to leave them in Altrincham. That left us without the man whom we had felt could handle our Way Builders and without Nancy whom we had thought would have been able to handle our bookkeeping."

The blunders keep piling up....all because of THE DECISION TO LOCATE AT GARTMORE.

Now, they've got to figure out logistics of leadership, personnel, et al.

Heck, it's what UPS or FedEx people DO on a daily basis.

Geer and his bumbling buffoons have NO BUSINESS trying to lead others.

And, this is the guy who set up all kinds of franchises for his classes??

:biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/>

Okay, One More....just to emphasize Blundering Onward

....[POP paper] "When we moved into the facility, there was one telephone which worked only sporadically. We had selected a telephone system to replace the single wall phone that existed upon arrival, but due to the costs involved and other factors we had decided to run all the internal cables ourselves."

One. Telephone. That. Worked. Only. Sporadically.

OMG.....I can't stop laughing. :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/> :biglaugh:/>/>

.

Sky, I know when I first read the PooP paper, I couldn't believe how many mistakes Geer made in buying Gartmore.  I have never bought any type of home, so I don't know all of the things involved with it.  But, I thought people usually had blueprints drawn, and other plans in place before they bought a home.  Why would he buy a place that is hard to drive to, or had little access to public transportation??   Or is in such shabby condition??  On, and on he whines about everything that was wrong with it. So why did you buy it??  OMG, the entire paper was nonsense.  In my opinion, it seemed to me that he had no idea of what he was doing.  And this guy was supposed to be the head of The Way of GB??!!

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