. . . TWI has essentially dissolved into smaller fellowships that may echo the former "glory" of TWI, but will probably never achieve it for themselves.
A lot of us either weren't born yet or simply never saw any "glory days". VPW may or may not have actually existed . . . point being he never mattered.
You know, VPW would probably enjoy all the naysaying about him. I think he said something about it in PFAL. Something about the prophets not being easy to live with, and always being disrepected, despised, by the general populace. In his curious narcissistic way, he'd see all this badmouthing about him not as true exposure of that which he wished to hide, but of persecution because of his bold stand on the word and his making the truth known like it hasn't been known since ... since Year 1 in his school.
A lot of us either weren't born yet or simply never saw any "glory days". VPW may or may not have actually existed . . . point being he never mattered.
TWI is like a battle for a memory.
I get your point, now, I think.... well, maybe at least a little bit.
In the minds of many of the people you know or knew in or from TWI, Wierwille is simply a myth. A story around which their church revolves.
And that makes sense, to me anyway.
Of course, to those of use now in our 50s and 60s, many of us did know him and have direct interaction with him. To us, he's not just a myth, but also a series of memories.
You know, VPW would probably enjoy all the naysaying about him. I think he said something about it in PFAL. Something about the prophets not being easy to live with, and always being disrepected, despised, by the general populace. In his curious narcissistic way, he'd see all this badmouthing about him not as true exposure of that which he wished to hide, but of persecution because of his bold stand on the word and his making the truth known like it hasn't been known since ... since Year 1 in his school.
I disagree.
I think he would CLAIM to enjoy it.
vpw was an accomplished spin-doctor. He made all his deficiencies sound
like strengths to be admired. He preferred to have adulation and
Also, people who complete the Way Corps training are thought to be qualified for marital, personal, family, and financial counseling even though there is no training in the Way Corps program relative counseling of any kind. No licensed or professional counselors provide any serious training in these fields. They are also considered qualified for major management positions even though, once again, there is no training on management practices in the Way Corps. In other words, The Way Corps basically rewards ignorance as well as awarding unquestioning obedience to their direct and overall leadership.
The only formal training in the corps has been:
Dale Carnegie training in SALES
Some people would claim the rock-climbing was professional training,
but if it was, it wouldn't have been conducted the way it was-
which meant there wouldn't have been crippling injuries.
BTW, vpw STOLE the Carnegie training. He had someone take the training,
then reteach it while giving them neither credit NOR TUITION.
Since vpw based his career on those sorts of practices, really, this
should surprise no one.
I really do think it's surreal that the corps were told, despite having
no training in any such things- that they were qualified to do counseling
in general, marriage counseling, and to work as management in corporations.
That's why there's so many horror stories about people being told rather
insane-sounding things from corps who were trying to "counsel" them,
or order/bully them into doing, depending on the situation.
(snip)
Similar to the Roman Catholic Church, the top leader of The Way International is thought of to speak for God on the earth. While a Way member would never admit that the top leader is in effect a pope, the practice indicates this is the case.
Right after lcm started making his pronouncements in 1988 and claiming
he was supposed to be obeyed,
I began pointing out that this is the same man who's lambasted popes for
several years for their practices-
who was now claiming Papal Infallibility and Apostolic Succession.
Naturally, he had no idea he was claiming the same things Popes ever claimed-
his education on the Papacy he was ridiculing was rather stunted.
I spent time in sales with real companies and I really wouldn't equate what was taught in TWC as "formal sales training". If it was, it fell way short. By the way, I don't think VP sent anyone to the Dale Carnegie Training. I think it was more that someone who was a trainer took PFAL and then taught the WC. Still, it really wouldn't qualify as formal imo. If one was going to sell as a profession they needed more.
I think the whole thing caused a lot of damage. It equated what some call "witnessing" and others call "sharing one's faith" with sales. There's a world of difference. I mean, it's not even the same thing. If you try to mix those Dale Carnegie or any sales techniques with sharing your faith, you will end up manipulating and will take Jesus Christ right out of the mix. Which is what TWI did anyway.
I remember there was a definition they put out themselves.I'm not sure I will quote it perfectly but it was something along the lines of *we are a research, teaching and fellowship ministry*. There were other qualifiers in there about people * availing themselves freely* and other statements that looked good. Does anyone have that definition?
I remember there was a definition they put out themselves.I'm not sure I will quote it perfectly but it was something along the lines of *we are a research, teaching and fellowship ministry*. There were other qualifiers in there about people * availing themselves freely* and other statements that looked good. Does anyone have that definition?
We had to memorize it in the Way Corps. Here is what I remember of it: "The Way is a fellowship of the followers of the Lord Jesus Christ for the manifestation of the more abundant life. A follower of the Way is filled with, and manifests power from on high, holy spirit, and freely avails himself of .... for spiritual nurture and growth."
I have been "out" for 19 years come January 11, so that is obviously not exact ... oddly, I have found no need to remember those words in my post-Way years.
We had to memorize it in the Way Corps. Here is what I remember of it: "The Way is a fellowship of the followers of the Lord Jesus Christ for the manifestation of the more abundant life. A follower of the Way is filled with, and manifests power from on high, holy spirit, and freely avails himself of .... for spiritual nurture and growth."
I have been "out" for 19 years come January 11, so that is obviously not exact ... oddly, I have found no need to remember those words in my post-Way years. :rolleyes:/>
OMG doglover, they made it into a song at some point. It just came back as I read your words . . . ha ha ha
Recommended Posts
Bolshevik
A lot of us either weren't born yet or simply never saw any "glory days". VPW may or may not have actually existed . . . point being he never mattered.
TWI is like a battle for a memory.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Twinky
You know, VPW would probably enjoy all the naysaying about him. I think he said something about it in PFAL. Something about the prophets not being easy to live with, and always being disrepected, despised, by the general populace. In his curious narcissistic way, he'd see all this badmouthing about him not as true exposure of that which he wished to hide, but of persecution because of his bold stand on the word and his making the truth known like it hasn't been known since ... since Year 1 in his school.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Rocky
I get your point, now, I think.... well, maybe at least a little bit.
In the minds of many of the people you know or knew in or from TWI, Wierwille is simply a myth. A story around which their church revolves.
And that makes sense, to me anyway.
Of course, to those of use now in our 50s and 60s, many of us did know him and have direct interaction with him. To us, he's not just a myth, but also a series of memories.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
I disagree.
I think he would CLAIM to enjoy it.
vpw was an accomplished spin-doctor. He made all his deficiencies sound
like strengths to be admired. He preferred to have adulation and
admiration-he considered it his due.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
The only formal training in the corps has been:
Dale Carnegie training in SALES
Some people would claim the rock-climbing was professional training,
but if it was, it wouldn't have been conducted the way it was-
which meant there wouldn't have been crippling injuries.
BTW, vpw STOLE the Carnegie training. He had someone take the training,
then reteach it while giving them neither credit NOR TUITION.
Since vpw based his career on those sorts of practices, really, this
should surprise no one.
I really do think it's surreal that the corps were told, despite having
no training in any such things- that they were qualified to do counseling
in general, marriage counseling, and to work as management in corporations.
That's why there's so many horror stories about people being told rather
insane-sounding things from corps who were trying to "counsel" them,
or order/bully them into doing, depending on the situation.
Right after lcm started making his pronouncements in 1988 and claiming
he was supposed to be obeyed,
I began pointing out that this is the same man who's lambasted popes for
several years for their practices-
who was now claiming Papal Infallibility and Apostolic Succession.
Naturally, he had no idea he was claiming the same things Popes ever claimed-
his education on the Papacy he was ridiculing was rather stunted.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Broken Arrow
I spent time in sales with real companies and I really wouldn't equate what was taught in TWC as "formal sales training". If it was, it fell way short. By the way, I don't think VP sent anyone to the Dale Carnegie Training. I think it was more that someone who was a trainer took PFAL and then taught the WC. Still, it really wouldn't qualify as formal imo. If one was going to sell as a profession they needed more.
I think the whole thing caused a lot of damage. It equated what some call "witnessing" and others call "sharing one's faith" with sales. There's a world of difference. I mean, it's not even the same thing. If you try to mix those Dale Carnegie or any sales techniques with sharing your faith, you will end up manipulating and will take Jesus Christ right out of the mix. Which is what TWI did anyway.
Edited by Broken ArrowLink to comment
Share on other sites
krys
I remember there was a definition they put out themselves.I'm not sure I will quote it perfectly but it was something along the lines of *we are a research, teaching and fellowship ministry*. There were other qualifiers in there about people * availing themselves freely* and other statements that looked good. Does anyone have that definition?
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bolshevik
It used to be in the front cover of every way-mag
Link to comment
Share on other sites
DogLover
We had to memorize it in the Way Corps. Here is what I remember of it: "The Way is a fellowship of the followers of the Lord Jesus Christ for the manifestation of the more abundant life. A follower of the Way is filled with, and manifests power from on high, holy spirit, and freely avails himself of .... for spiritual nurture and growth."
I have been "out" for 19 years come January 11, so that is obviously not exact ... oddly, I have found no need to remember those words in my post-Way years.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Bolshevik
OMG doglover, they made it into a song at some point. It just came back as I read your words . . . ha ha ha
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JavaJane
Thank you for that memory, Bolshie... Now I need to go listen to something more uplifting to get it out of my head... Like Rob Zombie.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.