Jump to content
GreaseSpot Cafe
skyrider

Open Letter to Jean-Yves De Lisle

Recommended Posts

On 2/14/2020 at 8:37 PM, T-Bone said:

 

Great posts! Here’s a few thoughts I had after reading them.

I think I learned more about honesty and empathy from my Mom & Dad than I ever did from wierwille. And my parents taught me that stuff – not by lectures or sermons on how to be a good Christian – but by how they lived their lives in raising me and my siblings. As a parent myself – now looking back on my folks – I believe I draw some inspiration of self-sacrifice for my kids by recalling how they would be supportive of our interests and dreams – not only financially – but even in just talking with us about all that stuff. That is a crazy interesting thing about parenthood – there’s someone who is a part of me – yet separate from me – who may have some totally different hopes and dreams than me…fascinating!

I didn’t always feel that way about my parents. I’ve shared this before  on another thread cults: the art of deception  ...While growing up I was influenced by the counterculture of the 60s – there formed a gap between me and my parents. When the glue of family ties is weakened we may be attracted to a group that seems to satisfy our sense of belonging. But after being in TWI for some 12 years – I became disillusioned with them – and it took me some time to figure out why. Basically it amounts to there being nothing like the real thing when it comes to family ties - even as imperfect as they may be and as hurtful as they may be at times - there is a real connection there. Blood is thicker than water as the expression goes.

In general, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with groups (churches, organizations, friends, etc.) that help you see the value in life or even just help you cope with life. I think my weak family ties made me vulnerable – set me up as a target – for the leader of a pseudo-family. Yes, wierwille in all his narcissistic glory  was the “patriarch” of this pseudo-family. His pet saying of “I have no friends when it comes to the word” speaks volumes about his exaggerated feeling of self-importance and his lack of empathy to how others felt. wierwille’s pet dictum really covers it all – "I have no friends - or ties to an earthly family for that matter - when it comes to the word"…really ? where does it say that in the Bible? Chapter and verse please.

The twisted version of self-sacrifice I learned during my 12 year involvement with TWI was that I was expected to put the priorities of The Way International ahead of everything else in my life. Actual family ties you may have  are subjugated by the “reality of your spiritual family”   (contrary to the bogus claim on the back of the PFAL sign up card “develops more harmony in the home”). . it's a variation of the previously mentioned dictum:  don’t let anyone – not even your earthly family come between you and your spiritual family of The Way International....    how many marriages, families and friends were split up because a TWI follower was "taking a stand on the word"? and you know there were a lot of situations where upper leadership put the pressure on folks to make a choice between staying with The Way International or staying with their spouse who didn't see eye to eye with upper leadership.

Sure glad I left that mess. In my ever evolving opinion, when it comes to family stuff - I see in the Bible a lot of stuff  about reconciliation (  the prodigal son    for example...or better yet, how about seeing reconciliation as having a higher priority than even worship in   Matthew 5:23, 24      )  . I believe having patience, being supportive...having forgiveness, and empathy towards others...especially family members is a big deal.

It's good to see the different backgrounds and experiences we all brought to "The Word" of God. 

I had and have little tolerance for what I call "imperial entanglements". Raised Roman Catholic and well educated in the religion I dropped all but the ideas and some of the beliefs by the age of 18. Straight forward teaching and reading in and from the Bible brought me back to Christ and a consideration of the Biblical history of mankind as more than a myth. So I went from a faith defined by ritual and tradition to a faith defined by relationship and the immediacy of that relationship's experience.

For the time I was in the Way I deliberately accepted what we were doing as something that I was willing to try so I could see where it would go. I already knew from my first couple years of rebirth into the Christian faith I didn't need another church or another Pope or another set of rules and regs. I bought into the work so that I could see if we could succeed with teaching and music, and the overall vision of "WOW", and reaching people with Christ and the teaching of the Bible. 

So I never gave up my family relationships, we were always in touch and I considered them about the same as I always had and I was fortunate that they loved me and cared about what I wanted to do. 

I never felt that VPW's "Way Family" culture he built worked. I got what we were trying to do and I was part of it for several years but it suffered from a form of stasis, caused by how it chose to grow. Ironic, yes but not uncommon in how organizations grow. If an organization tries to dig itself in and establish a rigid culture it can implode while exploding. Messy. 

The Way's culture was hierarchical, structured and controlled by a central authority. We would say "its the Word" but in practice the central authority of the organization as the Way Corps took prominence in the hierarchy, was Dr. Wierwille. 

There are many ways to do the same things, but in the Way we got stuck doing things one way - his way. His preferences and ideas drove the direction most of the major programs went in. That approach continued with Craig and proceeded to fail in lesser hands as it became possible for us to look over several years and see how it all worked out. 

It could change, even today with De Lisle or whoever's in charge - but inertia's preeeeeeetty well got them going in a set direction and way of doing things so I wouldn't hold my breath. Then again, anything can happen. It's up to them. 

I'm sure if they made some cosmetic changes, moved the furniture around a little and said some nice things, show PFAL a few times again, there'd be some people flocking back. 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, socks said:

(snip)...The Way's culture was hierarchical, structured and controlled by a central authority. We would say "its the Word" but in practice the central authority of the organization as the Way Corps took prominence in the hierarchy, was Dr. Wierwille. 

There are many ways to do the same things, but in the Way we got stuck doing things one way - his way. His preferences and ideas drove the direction most of the major programs went in. That approach continued with Craig and proceeded to fail in lesser hands as it became possible for us to look over several years and see how it all worked out. 

It could change, even today with De Lisle or whoever's in charge - but inertia's preeeeeeetty well got them going in a set direction and way of doing things so I wouldn't hold my breath. Then again, anything can happen. It's up to them. 

I'm sure if they made some cosmetic changes, moved the furniture around a little and said some nice things, show PFAL a few times again, there'd be some people flocking back. 

 

A great point there, Socks…you using the word “inertia” reminded me of something I found on Wikipedia regarding mindset  

“A mindset may be so firmly established that it creates a powerful incentive within these people or groups to continue to adopt or accept prior behaviors, choices, or tools. The latter phenomenon is also sometimes described as mental inertia, "groupthink", and it is often difficult to counteract its effects upon analysis and decision making processes.”

 

I heard something on the news the other day about an investigation left on autopilot…This idea fascinated me so I found a definition of autopilot  

"The literal meaning of autopilot is a device that steers a ship, plane, or spacecraft by itself, without a person. However, the expression “on autopilot” has developed a different meaning. Here are some typical uses of the expression “on autopilot,” which should make its meaning clear:

He wasn’t thinking very hard, he just did his job on autopilot. 

Instead of driving to school my brain was on autopilot, and I started driving to work!

By the third week of her campaign for mayor, Quimby was making all of her speeches on autopilot.

As you can tell from the examples above, to do something on autopilot means to do it without focusing on it, without thinking about what is happening."

 

In a sense I can think of a certain mindset as being on autopilot. Where I’m doing something, going through the motions without really thinking about it.

I agree with you - things could change – but that depends on if top leadership is willing to make the effort to change the direction of the existing mental inertia. That's a pretty tall order.

 

Edited by T-Bone
formatting

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, T-Bone said:

A great point there, Socks…you using the word “inertia” reminded me of something I found on Wikipedia regarding mindset  

“A mindset may be so firmly established that it creates a powerful incentive within these people or groups to continue to adopt or accept prior behaviors, choices, or tools. The latter phenomenon is also sometimes described as mental inertia, "groupthink", and it is often difficult to counteract its effects upon analysis and decision making processes.”

 

I heard something on the news the other day about an investigation left on autopilot…This idea fascinated me so I found a definition of autopilot  

"The literal meaning of autopilot is a device that steers a ship, plane, or spacecraft by itself, without a person. However, the expression “on autopilot” has developed a different meaning. Here are some typical uses of the expression “on autopilot,” which should make its meaning clear:

He wasn’t thinking very hard, he just did his job on autopilot. 

Instead of driving to school my brain was on autopilot, and I started driving to work!

By the third week of her campaign for mayor, Quimby was making all of her speeches on autopilot.

As you can tell from the examples above, to do something on autopilot means to do it without focusing on it, without thinking about what is happening."

 

In a sense I can think of a certain mindset as being on autopilot. Where I’m doing something, going through the motions without really thinking about it.

I agree with you - things could change – but that depends on if top leadership is willing to make the effort to change the direction of the existing mental inertia. That's a pretty tall order.

 

Autopilot is something humans do without conscious thought. That's what habits are. Much of what we do every day is done without conscious thought.

1.autopilot - a cognitive state in which you act without self-awareness; "she went about her chores on automatic pilot"; "too much of the writing seems to have been done on automatic pilot"; "she talked and he dozed and my mind went on autopilot"

automatic pilot

unconsciousness - a state lacking normal awareness of the self or environment

 

Edited by Rocky

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In terms of 1) inertia, 2) automatic pilot and 3) unconsciousness..........imo, those apply to the underlings, NOT the leadership.

As socks stated above.... "The Way's culture was hierarchical, structured and controlled by a central authority. We would say "its the Word" but in practice the central authority of the organization as the Way Corps took prominence in the hierarchy, was Dr. Wierwille.  There are many ways to do the same things, but in the Way we got stuck doing things one way - his way. His preferences and ideas drove the direction most of the major programs went in." 

Wierwille was the CENTRAL AUTHORITY OF TWI and he was not on autopilot!

The doctrines of wierwille were instilled thru the subtle , gentle arm of the "re-education camps" [pfal classes]..........1) We have NO friends when it comes to "the word," 2) Your family, friends, co-workers and church leaders may forsake you....but this "word of God" will never forsake you, 3) If there are places in the Bible where this "word" is wrong, I will tell you, 4) The law of believing is the greatest law in the whole universe,  5) All the women in the kingdom belong to the king, 6) This "word" [that I teach] takes the place of the absent Christ, ......etc. etc.

But the pfal-doctrine was not enough to sustain wierwille's authoritarian structure.

Wierwille needed trained "instructors"........younger men and women, peers leading peers.

Wierwille was the author, abuser and enforcer of The Way Corps program......the next generation "Gestapo police force" that followed orders from central command [Wierwille].  The corps would be sent forth as disciplinarians of wierwille's doctrines, not as disciples of Christ.  Rigorous, manipulative exercises were deployed within the corps training to eliminate self-identity and reformat us to the collective will of our "masters."  When dissidents arose, wierwille and his top lieutenants quickly spotted the threat(s) and major confrontation erupted.....much of it, for public consumption.  Isolation.  Immersion.  Intimidation.  Indoctrination.

Corps were induced with the poison of wierwille's psycho-babble and pathologies:

  • wierwille's claim of snow-covered pumps on a sunny day to sanction his God-given calling
  • lock box secrecy, sexual favors to the man of god was a woman's gift of servitude
  • hot-blooded, vein-popping confrontations to corps.......yet, no devil spirit cast out
  • years of youth......talent, labor, money......stolen to prop up wierwille's bankrupt soul
  • in the end......wierwille "wished" he would have been the man he knew to be  ---- ppfffttt

Rather than go down this road of "inertia"...........might I suggest the words of DWBH

on page 1 of this thread.

~~~~~~~~

~~~~~~~~

 

"I left the TWIt gulag in December, 1986 after 16 years in the cesspool. I "graduated" from the Way corpse in August, 1976. I was in that thing Johnny the drunk Townsend called the Yak Twig after Chairman Geer the bus driver destroyed TWIt with his putsch paper about some legendary, supposedly benevolent "patriarch"  who was put one step above Saul of Tarsus as this man-o-gawd (MOG) for this our day and time and hour and minute and nanosecond.

I bought that purulent horse manure too, UNTIL I returned to your little mud hole in new Knoxville. I was on staff there from 1979-1986, when I left. That's where the truth and FACTS regarding dictor paul wierwille and his cult of perverted personality disorders began staring me in the face. Slowly but relentlessly those FACTS were oozing from the belly of that beast daily. The cognitive dissonance and abject immorality of what dictor and his boyz in da hoods were doing was horrifying. Truly and wildly against everything our Lord Christ stands for today. Psychopatholigical, alcohol-driven madness which literally killed innocents and drove a significant number of others to suicide! ALL in the name of "God's rightly divided Word" lived "in the renewed mind in manifestation" with complete and total allegiance to the MOG, "The Teacher", wayfers' "Father in the Word".

Unlike you de Liar, I did not bury my head or heart in that TWIt toilet. It did not take me 28 years of blatant foot-kissing and personal compromise to realize that something IS very rotten in TWItville, Ohio! So wrong that, no authentic Christian could ever in good conscience before the Lord stay there and continue to poison the waters of life for the genuine Christians who wanted just to love God and serve the bread of life to those in need.

And yet, here you are in 2016 agreeing to preside over that fraud of a minus-tray as if nothing bad enough ever happened that you must repent of before God and His Church, and ask for forgiveness from BOTH! That should be your number one task. But, I'm sure YOU don't "see the need" to do that, because you'd never agree to be  pwesident if you even hinted at doing this right thing.

This after 28 years at the vortex of sin and spiritual illness that your precious headquarters continues to live and promote. That means you were there during dem fawg years. That means you signed da forehead's loyalty oath. That means you went through and SUPPORTED, the homo purges, the ending of the ROA and the WOW program due to "homo infiltration". The screaming, spit-filled propaganda and hate speech against all us possessed cop-outs, non-stop every day for years. The public humiliation and destruction of ANY & ALL opposition or perceived "rebellion"  against his MOGship. The incredible fascist, neo-Nazi malignant  paranoid narcissism which eventually threw out any bible and replaced it with "genuine spiritual suspicion" as the main rule of "faith and practice". The "no debt" lunacy. The fun enforcement of "mark and avoid". Taking the "prevailing word" and locking it up behind the newly constructed walls of Zion that you morons consented to. The remake of dictor's PFAL into an even more incoherently insane WAP class. The pathetic Way Disciples program to replace WOWs. The overt and persistent pathological serial rape and sexual assault that Da Forehead's perverted "father in the word" taught the boy to do so well, and with rabid enthusiasm. And, your pal Ros-a-lie also participated in enthusiastically as well with dictor paul himself, and Howard and Don, and literally scores of other MOGs including members of my corpse which she was in-rez with when she began in the Family Corpse II in August, 1975! Male and female Monsieur de Liar! Ask Ms. Lombardi-Martindale about that! Denial. Obfuscation. Outright pathological lying. Blame shifting and finger pointing is what you've been taught to accept and demand. That's what you accept with your revisionist history of Da Forehead's two "settled" serial rape and sexual assault charges, along with Rosie's whitewashed version of her own admissions to the criminal sexual behavior of the Da forehead and others that are in the sealed settlement documents. If you know all this after 28 years and you're still there, my de Liar moniker fits you quite well Monsieur! And, you'll wear it with PRIDE I'm sure.

Unlike the far more kind Skyrider, I'm not wasting one nanosecond of my Christian prayer life on you, or any of the rest of you hypocritical, whited sepulchers. You are anti(against)-Christ in words and works. You are vain babblers, ever learning yet never coming to the knowledge of the truth. You are an insult to the Lord who bought you. You are a false teacher. You and your rosie suffer from the root of all evil.....the love of money. You preach for filthy lucre's sake. You plagiarize the plagiarizers. You bow  your knee to Baal. You are anathema to the Lord Jesus Christ and His Heavenly Father. You have been weighed in the balances and found wanting. Your "ministry" is a sham and a fraud. You serve the god of this world. REPENT! Ask God for forgiveness and apologize to those whom you have despitefully used. You have raped and plundered The Good Shepherd's precious flock. Their blood is on your hands. You cannot fool God! You cannot hide from the Righteous Judge either. You return to your own vomit, day after day, year after year. The blood of the righteous which you have shed screams through the ground against you. My only prayer for you is, "May the Lord have mercy upon your souls."

 

 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Skyrider for getting us back on track...gee I wonder if Mike B or Raymo ever read that first page...well, here's a second chance

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...