But I looked at an old WC notes section, a rant from Craig in about 2006, and I just wanted to yell back at him about all the stuff that was WRONG in his haha "teaching" or rant or whatever you call it. How contradictory in so very many ways. How overbearingly bullying. How demanding everything was and how it demeaned EVERY believer.
Seriously unhinged.
Not surprising I was so f'ked up when the M&A'd me. Several years of these rants and no ability to say, hey mate, ease up a bit!
The documents that I glanced at on the old site enraged me. (Possibly even with cult-brain, they'd have pi$$ed me off badly.) Maybe, sometimes it's good to look back at where we came from, and realise just what prisons we have been released from .
But I looked at an old WC notes section, a rant from Craig in about 2006, and I just wanted to yell back at him about all the stuff that was WRONG in his haha "teaching" or rant or whatever you call it. How contradictory in so very many ways. How overbearingly bullying. How demanding everything was and how it demeaned EVERY believer.
Seriously unhinged.
Not surprising I was so f'ked up when the M&A'd me. Several years of these rants and no ability to say, hey mate, ease up a bit!
The documents that I glanced at on the old site enraged me. (Possibly even with cult-brain, they'd have pi$$ed me off badly.) Maybe, sometimes it's good to look back at where we came from, and realise just what prisons we have been released from .
I'm so glad you (WE) have gotten through and healed from that emotional and spiritual abuse.
But I looked at an old WC notes section, a rant from Craig in about 2006, and I just wanted to yell back at him about all the stuff that was WRONG in his haha "teaching" or rant or whatever you call it. How contradictory in so very many ways. How overbearingly bullying. How demanding everything was and how it demeaned EVERY believer.
Seriously unhinged.
Not surprising I was so f'ked up when the M&A'd me. Several years of these rants and no ability to say, hey mate, ease up a bit!
The documents that I glanced at on the old site enraged me. (Possibly even with cult-brain, they'd have pi$$ed me off badly.) Maybe, sometimes it's good to look back at where we came from, and realise just what prisons we have been released from .
I left at a good place and time to leave. In NY State (let alone City), nearly all the leadership and most of the rank-and-file got fed up in 1988-1989 when lcm made a blanket accusation that ALL the state's leaders (he mentioned each by name) were serving themselves and not God Almighty. Since we'd worked with them and knew them personally- and he was largely a stranger- it wasn't hard to see how people would respond. It went over like a lead balloon. (When I say most of the rank-and-file left, I'm not kidding. If I'd have stayed, I probably would have ended up #2 in the Bronx and a Branch coordinator, all in one step from humble peon. Not that there were active Twigs to form the Branch- my entire Branch walked except for one guy. He was now #1 in what was left of the Bronx, and he went from humble peon in one step also, albeit a peon who'd taken the Advanced Class.)
Anyway, in the absence of any way to respond directly to lcm, we voted with our feet and sent one heck of a message when the entire state largely emptied out. NYC was definitely gone almost to a man, as well as the other cities, leaving a few Twigs in the middle of nowhere who thought blind loyalty was the most important thing, and bent over when lcm mailed us his accusations.
So, we did indeed send a message, just not a written one.
I left at a good place and time to leave. In NY State (let alone City), nearly all the leadership and most of the rank-and-file got fed up in 1988-1989 when lcm made a blanket accusation that ALL the state's leaders (he mentioned each by name) were serving themselves and not God Almighty. Since we'd worked with them and knew them personally- and he was largely a stranger- it wasn't hard to see how people would respond. It went over like a lead balloon. (When I say most of the rank-and-file left, I'm not kidding. If I'd have stayed, I probably would have ended up #2 in the Bronx and a Branch coordinator, all in one step from humble peon. Not that there were active Twigs to form the Branch- my entire Branch walked except for one guy. He was now #1 in what was left of the Bronx, and he went from humble peon in one step also, albeit a peon who'd taken the Advanced Class.)
Anyway, in the absence of any way to respond directly to lcm, we voted with our feet and sent one heck of a message when the entire state largely emptied out. NYC was definitely gone almost to a man, as well as the other cities, leaving a few Twigs in the middle of nowhere who thought blind loyalty was the most important thing, and bent over when lcm mailed us his accusations.
So, we did indeed send a message, just not a written one.
Yes that “fog years” time with Craig, Geer and the succession had 80% of the people on the rolls leaving. After the exodus was over then they retained approximately $65 million in cash plus their properties with a much smaller payroll.
I left at a good place and time to leave. In NY State (let alone City), nearly all the leadership and most of the rank-and-file got fed up in 1988-1989 when lcm made a blanket accusation that ALL the state's leaders (he mentioned each by name) were serving themselves and not God Almighty. Since we'd worked with them and knew them personally- and he was largely a stranger- it wasn't hard to see how people would respond. It went over like a lead balloon. (When I say most of the rank-and-file left, I'm not kidding. If I'd have stayed, I probably would have ended up #2 in the Bronx and a Branch coordinator, all in one step from humble peon. Not that there were active Twigs to form the Branch- my entire Branch walked except for one guy. He was now #1 in what was left of the Bronx, and he went from humble peon in one step also, albeit a peon who'd taken the Advanced Class.)
Anyway, in the absence of any way to respond directly to lcm, we voted with our feet and sent one heck of a message when the entire state largely emptied out. NYC was definitely gone almost to a man, as well as the other cities, leaving a few Twigs in the middle of nowhere who thought blind loyalty was the most important thing, and bent over when lcm mailed us his accusations.
So, we did indeed send a message, just not a written one.
Thanks for telling us about this. I've always wondered about your story ...
Thanks for telling us about this. I've always wondered about your story ...
If I'd been around a decade earlier, I doubtless would have been in the middle of things. Having been born a decade later and running into twi a decade later changed our interactions a lot. It didn't explain how uneasy some local leaders got- apparently, they thought I had plans to try to take their jobs or something rather than just learn everything I could and go as far as I could.
BTW, NY as a state and a city pretty much grew quickly. When things started there, there was a push to take the Foundational ASAP, then to take the Intermediate ASAP, and thence to run a local fellowship. After that, people arriving weren't rushed so much, so things were pushed at a more normal pace. When I showed up, recommendations looked more to me like a push per year per level, so, take the Foundational ASAP (and retake it), next year after retaking the Foundational take the Intermediate, and after retaking both the next year, look into taking the Advanced Class. Frankly, I thought that was a MUCH more sensible pace. If the idea was for the student to arrive at the Intermediate with a firm grasp of the Foundational, taking the 1st one twice first was a good idea. As for the Advanced, taking both 3x first, IMHO was a good idea if they needed to understand those classes first. As it was, I had enough of a grasp that I was starting to figure out some of the Advanced class content before getting there. Well, if you understand everything it's built on, then it's possible, depending on how well you understand it and how far the next class goes.
Attached is an old Way document: A form letter from Craig Martindale in 1990 to all Way Corps. Weirdly, I was already OUT. Escaped HQ in 1987. He was well aware of that and of my unmendable break from TWI!
But of course we know these letters were sent out to everyone on the Corps list without consideration for details like whether or not they'd repudiated TWI. LOL.
Attached is an old Way document: A form letter from Craig Martindale in 1990 to all Way Corps. Weirdly, I was already OUT. Escaped HQ in 1987. He was well aware of that and of my unmendable break from TWI!
But of course we know these letters were sent out to everyone on the Corps list without consideration for details like whether or not they'd repudiated TWI. LOL.
In that letter, Loy invokes the name of Jesus Christ... but his attitude shows something very different. I didn't sense any willingness on his part to serve.
Attached is an old Way document: A form letter from Craig Martindale in 1990 to all Way Corps. Weirdly, I was already OUT. Escaped HQ in 1987. He was well aware of that and of my unmendable break from TWI!
But of course we know these letters were sent out to everyone on the Corps list without consideration for details like whether or not they'd repudiated TWI. LOL.
Did he write this while driving?
Was no one available to proofread this letter before mailing?
That huge, disjointed, stream of consciousness first paragraph is a rambling mess. I can hear the rage, the fury, the desperation, the fear. What a childish tantrum!
If this is what "spiritual maturity" looks like.... mmmph.... no thanks.
The Lord Jesus Christ appears in the greeting. But then disappears throughout the rest of the letter, which is focused on “The Way Tree” of “The Way International”, and the leadership that “God and Dr Wierwille appointed”
There are so many more cults with “God Appointed” leaders than we realize.
I mean you would think that Gods only job is to travel around and do miracles for crackpots to get them to start new cults.
I will say in that letter where Craig uses a description from Timothy about people floating around on their little piece of debris thinking it is a luxury liner - I've never heard a better description for The Way International than that - although he was using it to label Corps who left.
Attached is an old Way document: A form letter from Craig Martindale in 1990 to all Way Corps. Weirdly, I was already OUT. Escaped HQ in 1987. He was well aware of that and of my unmendable break from TWI!
But of course we know these letters were sent out to everyone on the Corps list without consideration for details like whether or not they'd repudiated TWI. LOL.
Ironic LCM casts aspersions on those who float around on debris, but held so very proudly that he was a part of the remnent of those left in TWI. LOL. Now he is one of those whom are floating around on the debris with his online teachings. Or does he still see himself aboard the luxury liner?
Ironic LCM casts aspersions on those who float around on debris, but held so very proudly that he was a part of the remnent of those left in TWI. LOL. Now he is one of those whom are floating around on the debris with his online teachings. Or does he still see himself aboard the luxury liner?
More like a cigarette boat, and not merely aboard, but piloting with great athleticism, power and speed. There’s more than enough room on a cigarette boat for his handful of followers.
More like a cigarette boat, and not merely aboard, but piloting with great athleticism, power and speed. There’s more than enough room on a cigarette boat for his handful of followers.
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Twinky
Some interesting stuff there.
But I looked at an old WC notes section, a rant from Craig in about 2006, and I just wanted to yell back at him about all the stuff that was WRONG in his haha "teaching" or rant or whatever you call it. How contradictory in so very many ways. How overbearingly bullying. How demanding everything was and how it demeaned EVERY believer.
Seriously unhinged.
Not surprising I was so f'ked up when the M&A'd me. Several years of these rants and no ability to say, hey mate, ease up a bit!
The documents that I glanced at on the old site enraged me. (Possibly even with cult-brain, they'd have pi$$ed me off badly.) Maybe, sometimes it's good to look back at where we came from, and realise just what prisons we have been released from
.
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Rocky
I'm so glad you (WE) have gotten through and healed from that emotional and spiritual abuse.
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WordWolf
The menus for all the old documents are in this thread:
https://www.greasespotcafe.com/ipb/topic/24519-greasespot-cafe-documents-and-audio-archives/
Greasespot Cafe Documents and Audio Archives.
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WordWolf
I left at a good place and time to leave. In NY State (let alone City), nearly all the leadership and most of the rank-and-file got fed up in 1988-1989 when lcm made a blanket accusation that ALL the state's leaders (he mentioned each by name) were serving themselves and not God Almighty. Since we'd worked with them and knew them personally- and he was largely a stranger- it wasn't hard to see how people would respond. It went over like a lead balloon. (When I say most of the rank-and-file left, I'm not kidding. If I'd have stayed, I probably would have ended up #2 in the Bronx and a Branch coordinator, all in one step from humble peon. Not that there were active Twigs to form the Branch- my entire Branch walked except for one guy. He was now #1 in what was left of the Bronx, and he went from humble peon in one step also, albeit a peon who'd taken the Advanced Class.)
Anyway, in the absence of any way to respond directly to lcm, we voted with our feet and sent one heck of a message when the entire state largely emptied out. NYC was definitely gone almost to a man, as well as the other cities, leaving a few Twigs in the middle of nowhere who thought blind loyalty was the most important thing, and bent over when lcm mailed us his accusations.
So, we did indeed send a message, just not a written one.
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chockfull
Yes that “fog years” time with Craig, Geer and the succession had 80% of the people on the rolls leaving. After the exodus was over then they retained approximately $65 million in cash plus their properties with a much smaller payroll.
This was the largest exodus.
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penworks
Thanks for telling us about this. I've always wondered about your story ...
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WordWolf
If I'd been around a decade earlier, I doubtless would have been in the middle of things. Having been born a decade later and running into twi a decade later changed our interactions a lot. It didn't explain how uneasy some local leaders got- apparently, they thought I had plans to try to take their jobs or something rather than just learn everything I could and go as far as I could.
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WordWolf
BTW, NY as a state and a city pretty much grew quickly. When things started there, there was a push to take the Foundational ASAP, then to take the Intermediate ASAP, and thence to run a local fellowship. After that, people arriving weren't rushed so much, so things were pushed at a more normal pace. When I showed up, recommendations looked more to me like a push per year per level, so, take the Foundational ASAP (and retake it), next year after retaking the Foundational take the Intermediate, and after retaking both the next year, look into taking the Advanced Class. Frankly, I thought that was a MUCH more sensible pace. If the idea was for the student to arrive at the Intermediate with a firm grasp of the Foundational, taking the 1st one twice first was a good idea. As for the Advanced, taking both 3x first, IMHO was a good idea if they needed to understand those classes first. As it was, I had enough of a grasp that I was starting to figure out some of the Advanced class content before getting there. Well, if you understand everything it's built on, then it's possible, depending on how well you understand it and how far the next class goes.
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penworks
LCM letter 1990.pdf
Attached is an old Way document: A form letter from Craig Martindale in 1990 to all Way Corps. Weirdly, I was already OUT. Escaped HQ in 1987. He was well aware of that and of my unmendable break from TWI!
But of course we know these letters were sent out to everyone on the Corps list without consideration for details like whether or not they'd repudiated TWI. LOL.
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Rocky
In that letter, Loy invokes the name of Jesus Christ... but his attitude shows something very different. I didn't sense any willingness on his part to serve.
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Nathan_Jr
"Their words and their convoluted explanations are simply a pretense for their greed and malicious intent."
Well, well, well. Lookie who we have here. Our old friend Irony. Hello, Irony.
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Nathan_Jr
Did he write this while driving?
Was no one available to proofread this letter before mailing?
That huge, disjointed, stream of consciousness first paragraph is a rambling mess. I can hear the rage, the fury, the desperation, the fear. What a childish tantrum!
If this is what "spiritual maturity" looks like.... mmmph.... no thanks.
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Nathan_Jr
This letter could be used for an apophatic understanding of leadership and persuasive discourse.
Who was Loy's teacher? Who is he imitating? On whose shoulders is he standing?
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chockfull
The Lord Jesus Christ appears in the greeting. But then disappears throughout the rest of the letter, which is focused on “The Way Tree” of “The Way International”, and the leadership that “God and Dr Wierwille appointed”
There are so many more cults with “God Appointed” leaders than we realize.
I mean you would think that Gods only job is to travel around and do miracles for crackpots to get them to start new cults.
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Rocky
Good one!
God forbid he would allow anyone to change anything he writes.
Yikes!
Irony indeed! And brazen emotional projection.
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chockfull
I will say in that letter where Craig uses a description from Timothy about people floating around on their little piece of debris thinking it is a luxury liner - I've never heard a better description for The Way International than that - although he was using it to label Corps who left.
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Stayed Too Long
Ironic LCM casts aspersions on those who float around on debris, but held so very proudly that he was a part of the remnent of those left in TWI. LOL. Now he is one of those whom are floating around on the debris with his online teachings. Or does he still see himself aboard the luxury liner?
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Nathan_Jr
More like a cigarette boat, and not merely aboard, but piloting with great athleticism, power and speed. There’s more than enough room on a cigarette boat for his handful of followers.
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Rocky
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