i don't know about other places we were to to hold a silent vigle at the tc's house. they had a shrine with vee pee's pic on it with cadles all his books etc.
with the pope and all the comments made today and this weekend it seemed well almost peaceful and like God was involved, I find it more than Ironic the guy did most of his suffering EASTER week ,(makes ya go hmm when ya think about it) and he really did have the Lord all the way through and to me testified of how to live and how to die with Jesus as Lord.
He always gloried God and never complained and his priests and people in command of the situation they didnt freak out and want to start a mutiny right away they know the time thing and are willing to allow the holy spirit do its job within them . I heard one priest say repeatly today it is up to the holy spirit within the men now to do its work to find out what the next pope amy be or mean.
what a contrast instead of bitching and complaining about who did what when wrong and who is right now!!!! like in twi when VPW died.
i remember John Lynns tape about how Ralph Do and others were losing their mind and unable to function when VPW was dying.
the priest and the laymen on the council in Rome look steadfast and speak of the Lord and holy spirit in stead of blaming confusion and disorder on the fog of a mans death.
they seem less afraid and more trusting of what the Lord will and does do for them, compared to utter devastation and flip out and mocking of one another when vpw died.
Quite a constrast indeed .
but then everyone knew who was top dog in twi when vpw died and that did have some of the problems , In Rome they all must wait and go through many days and rituals before any real changes will be seen. maybe after the new pope is seated the fighting and nutso behaviours will start but then maybe not it just appears so much more orderly and organized to me in the RC church and its processes of assiging a new pope.
People are actualy still faithful looking to God as the pope is dead, in twi people became fearful and fighting and blaming.
As I recall when V.P. died it was treated very matter of factly and business like.
1. Rehearsed message given to everyone on phone list about him dying.
2. Everyone told to come over to TC house for dinner.
3. Told to be strong and that God will look out for us.
4. Watched some TWI video.
5. Went home
6. After funeral told Mrs. W. said something like "that's not Dr in the grave, just a dead body".
7. Life went on.
I felt we were not expected to, nor should we grieve. It was just time to move on. I really hated that part....saw no compassion what so ever for anyone.
Pope John Paul II was a good man, and I am sad for his passing.
When vpw passed away, I was on LEAD in South Dakota, and felt sad then also.
At the time ( when vpw passed), I thought a true man of God was gone.
Now I know a better one is gone, a real Man of God who walked the walk, and talked the talk, took his turn at being mortal, and succumbed to the limits that life has on us all.
Ironic -- when you think about it. I bought into twi, and revered vpw, and now I don't think he did such a good job.
I was raised Catholic, rejected the religion, and now I find John Paul (anyone else catch the irony of that name??), a better man than vpw.
Well, the Pope may have been a great world leader and all of that. But he certainly was no "Holy Father". The scripture is clear, that we are to call no one Father but God. And that is not "Waybrain" as some may think, it's just the Bible. It's too bad he died, but he lived a full 84 years, and that's nice and long these days. It seems to me that many people mourning him also seem to be worshipping him. It also seems that many children under his watch, within his world wide ministry have fallen prey to his "priests" who have turned out to be sexual predators. Any ministry that insists that men take a vow of celibacy is flat out asking for trouble, and we have seen it. I just don't find it in my heart to be too awfully hurt at his passing.
We have Ronald Reagan to thank for the fall of communism. Tell me though, what was the Pope's contirbution to the fall of communism? I am in the dark on this and I ask you honestly.
I have no wish to diminish the contribution made by the Great Communicator Jonny but his was not the only one.
John Paul came from a communist country, one where official atheism had never been able to extinguish religious fervour. He preached human rights consistently and inspired and encouraged movements which lead to the collapse of communist regimes producing a domino effect.
He utilised the diplomatic resources available to him to a very large effect as the Pope is also a Head of State besides a religious leader.
He had no weapons or armies to call upon, only words and moral authority.
Even some of his most verbal critics have conceded his role in this area.
He helped to inspire and support Lech Walesa and his Solidarnosc! movement.
And ok, Steve!, I'll buy that. I know that Lech Walesa was truly a ballsy man who stood up to Jaruzelski, the Polish Communist leader, and his Solidarity movement was perhaps the first group within a Soviet country to say "up yours" and begin to get away with.
And so Trefor, What you say seems to ring well with Steve! says also.
And Steve!, that exclamation mark after your name is soo obnoxious! :-)
It's just that I am somewhat of a punctuation and spelling Nazi, and when I put that exclamation mark there, it throws me off. It's fine when I read it, but when I have to write it, it's weird. Kinda like the Rain Man not being able to watch "Wheel-Of Fortune" every weekday at 3:00 p.m.
Kinda funny, to me...
In fact, I will take this moment to let everyone know that the reason I put Dr. Wierwille's name with a capital W, or The Way Corps spelled properly (not "Corp" by the way), and in the upper case, it is because I believe it is proper grammar. I like to write, and I figure that I should maintain proper writing habits, and not abandon them just because this is "just a thread" or "just an e-mail". I do not like Adolf Hitler and what he was, but I would still write his name properly.
Quick question here. In STL there's flags at half mast all over the city. I can't imagine this to be a direct order from the mayor, just a common token of respect. I was wondering if this is going on all over the country.
Recommended Posts
coolchef1248 @adelphia.net
i don't know about other places we were to to hold a silent vigle at the tc's house. they had a shrine with vee pee's pic on it with cadles all his books etc.
it was weird
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Kit Sober
I was really sad.
It wasn't until transchat/waydale/greasespot cafe days that things made sense.
John Paul II's passing is different because he was a man who lived what he preached.
When "those who were with him said he looked out the window and said 'amen' and then fell asleep" were not making it up.
John Paul II lived the love he knew to be.
I am really glad John Paul II lived. Not so with vpw.
Kit
Link to comment
Share on other sites
mj412
Again maybe it is me and growing up.
with the pope and all the comments made today and this weekend it seemed well almost peaceful and like God was involved, I find it more than Ironic the guy did most of his suffering EASTER week ,(makes ya go hmm when ya think about it) and he really did have the Lord all the way through and to me testified of how to live and how to die with Jesus as Lord.
He always gloried God and never complained and his priests and people in command of the situation they didnt freak out and want to start a mutiny right away they know the time thing and are willing to allow the holy spirit do its job within them . I heard one priest say repeatly today it is up to the holy spirit within the men now to do its work to find out what the next pope amy be or mean.
what a contrast instead of bitching and complaining about who did what when wrong and who is right now!!!! like in twi when VPW died.
i remember John Lynns tape about how Ralph Do and others were losing their mind and unable to function when VPW was dying.
the priest and the laymen on the council in Rome look steadfast and speak of the Lord and holy spirit in stead of blaming confusion and disorder on the fog of a mans death.
they seem less afraid and more trusting of what the Lord will and does do for them, compared to utter devastation and flip out and mocking of one another when vpw died.
Quite a constrast indeed .
but then everyone knew who was top dog in twi when vpw died and that did have some of the problems , In Rome they all must wait and go through many days and rituals before any real changes will be seen. maybe after the new pope is seated the fighting and nutso behaviours will start but then maybe not it just appears so much more orderly and organized to me in the RC church and its processes of assiging a new pope.
People are actualy still faithful looking to God as the pope is dead, in twi people became fearful and fighting and blaming.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
markomalley
MJ, just as a point of interest, consider the following:
They have elected the successor to Peter in largely the same manner (yes, a few changes, but not significant) for the past 2,000 years.
Just something to consider...
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Stayed Too Long
As I recall when V.P. died it was treated very matter of factly and business like.
1. Rehearsed message given to everyone on phone list about him dying.
2. Everyone told to come over to TC house for dinner.
3. Told to be strong and that God will look out for us.
4. Watched some TWI video.
5. Went home
6. After funeral told Mrs. W. said something like "that's not Dr in the grave, just a dead body".
7. Life went on.
I felt we were not expected to, nor should we grieve. It was just time to move on. I really hated that part....saw no compassion what so ever for anyone.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WordWolf
I'll tell you the difference between the deaths of Victor Paul Wierwille and
Karol Wojtyla, Pope John Paul II.
Pope John Paul II was the man he knew himself to be.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
dmiller
Pope John Paul II was a good man, and I am sad for his passing.
When vpw passed away, I was on LEAD in South Dakota, and felt sad then also.
At the time ( when vpw passed), I thought a true man of God was gone.
Now I know a better one is gone, a real Man of God who walked the walk, and talked the talk, took his turn at being mortal, and succumbed to the limits that life has on us all.
Ironic -- when you think about it. I bought into twi, and revered vpw, and now I don't think he did such a good job.
I was raised Catholic, rejected the religion, and now I find John Paul (anyone else catch the irony of that name??), a better man than vpw.
Go figure.
-->
Link to comment
Share on other sites
dmiller
To which I say -- Amen.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Trefor Heywood
John Paul was truly more international than VPW ever was amd he touched the lives of far more people.
Not always for the good but the good outweighs the bad.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
J0nny Ling0
Well, the Pope may have been a great world leader and all of that. But he certainly was no "Holy Father". The scripture is clear, that we are to call no one Father but God. And that is not "Waybrain" as some may think, it's just the Bible. It's too bad he died, but he lived a full 84 years, and that's nice and long these days. It seems to me that many people mourning him also seem to be worshipping him. It also seems that many children under his watch, within his world wide ministry have fallen prey to his "priests" who have turned out to be sexual predators. Any ministry that insists that men take a vow of celibacy is flat out asking for trouble, and we have seen it. I just don't find it in my heart to be too awfully hurt at his passing.
I think I was more bummed when Johnny Cash died.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Trefor Heywood
Some of what you write above Jonny comes under the bad.
But he sure as hell helped bring about the fall of Communism. I have no doubt about his personal holiness but he expected too much of others.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
J0nny Ling0
We have Ronald Reagan to thank for the fall of communism. Tell me though, what was the Pope's contirbution to the fall of communism? I am in the dark on this and I ask you honestly.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Steve!
He helped to inspire and support Lech Walesa and his Solidarnosc! movement.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
wyteduv58
I was busy having my last baby when vpw died and my family kept it from me so as not to spoil things for me, but I did mourn his death at the time.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Trefor Heywood
I have no wish to diminish the contribution made by the Great Communicator Jonny but his was not the only one.
John Paul came from a communist country, one where official atheism had never been able to extinguish religious fervour. He preached human rights consistently and inspired and encouraged movements which lead to the collapse of communist regimes producing a domino effect.
He utilised the diplomatic resources available to him to a very large effect as the Pope is also a Head of State besides a religious leader.
He had no weapons or armies to call upon, only words and moral authority.
Even some of his most verbal critics have conceded his role in this area.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
J0nny Ling0
Steve! said;
And ok, Steve!, I'll buy that. I know that Lech Walesa was truly a ballsy man who stood up to Jaruzelski, the Polish Communist leader, and his Solidarity movement was perhaps the first group within a Soviet country to say "up yours" and begin to get away with.
And so Trefor, What you say seems to ring well with Steve! says also.
And Steve!, that exclamation mark after your name is soo obnoxious! :-)
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Steve!
So my exclamation point is obnoxious, is it?
You want obnoxious, I've got your obnoxious right here!
So you don't like my attitude, well, too bad so sad sucks to be you!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
J0nny Ling0
It's just that I am somewhat of a punctuation and spelling Nazi, and when I put that exclamation mark there, it throws me off. It's fine when I read it, but when I have to write it, it's weird. Kinda like the Rain Man not being able to watch "Wheel-Of Fortune" every weekday at 3:00 p.m.
Kinda funny, to me...
In fact, I will take this moment to let everyone know that the reason I put Dr. Wierwille's name with a capital W, or The Way Corps spelled properly (not "Corp" by the way), and in the upper case, it is because I believe it is proper grammar. I like to write, and I figure that I should maintain proper writing habits, and not abandon them just because this is "just a thread" or "just an e-mail". I do not like Adolf Hitler and what he was, but I would still write his name properly.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WeWereScammed
This thread could more accurately be called "The Pope vs. The Dope"
Link to comment
Share on other sites
JustThinking
... or the Pontif versus the pontificator.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WeWereScammed
.....or The Holy Father versus the holey fodder
Link to comment
Share on other sites
dmiller
hmmmmm. Or the Vicar of Christ vs. THE Victor of Christ.
-->
Link to comment
Share on other sites
WeWereScammed
Did you mean The Victor of the absent Christ!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
johniam
Quick question here. In STL there's flags at half mast all over the city. I can't imagine this to be a direct order from the mayor, just a common token of respect. I was wondering if this is going on all over the country.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.