When we were adopting our son, we got everything short of a colonoscopy. Psychological profiles, home visits, four references of people who had known us for a certain length of time.
They checked a lot of stuff, including criminal records.
We were taught the right way to apply those verses. You're saying we weren't. You're rewriting history
Sorry, getting in this late. As a Family Corps person, back in the early 80's, not only did I witness the Corps leader smack a 3 year old repeatedly with a spoon on his thigh because he would not say "sorry", but I saw it happen again and again in "Children's Fellowship". This happened in the middle of the Hall as the poor baby cried so hard he was beside himself. He was 3!! The poor mom stood by, as, gosh, this was the Family Corps LEADER, he could not be wrong, could he? This is not love and this was not the correct use of "the rod". I was flat out bullying. Re-write history? No, just telling the truth. I think, OM, you only want to admit to the good you believe you saw. If anyone wishes to re-write history, it's you. The truth hurts sometimes. Deal with it. BUt don't call people liars, even if you don't specifically use that word.
After 5 months in the family corps (7), I told CB & GB to NEVER again hit, reprove physically, use the rod, whatever they wanted to call it, my children. If they were SO disobedient, come get me.
If anyone reads this, has anyone ever reported sexual child abuse in the Indiana campus? SO many threads it's hard to find.
God does heal hearts and minds. Sometimes it takes a long long long time. My son is 28 and is still not over being hit by some stranger. We were stupid to accept it. I am ashamed I did. My son has forgiven but will never forget.
I am so sorry Lady Cat....I can remember that I so envied those corpes kids, those who it appeared were fortunate enough to get to ride their parents spiritual coat tails through the corpes....
I naievly thought...*Gosh how wonderfull to be raised in the word by spiritually sharp parents...those little guys just don`t know how good they have it*
Who knew that they were enduring the vilest of treatment....
I am so ashamed that though unknowing, I facillitated this abuse by my support of this group:-(
Thanks for bringing this back to the top, someone asked me about it recently.
The most ludicrous thing of all is the corps leaders son who was a smart mouth and a bully, too. I caught him somewhere he was not supose to be and told him to please leave. He said "Do you know who my father is?" And I said , Yeah, do you know who MY Father is?" Never saw the rod used in public on THAT behind. No, corps kids had is rough. Between the townies calling them names and the repressed understanding of what-how kids act, they heard it all day long. My kids were little 4 & 5. It was harder for teens. No such thing as spiritual coat tails. Some learned that harder than others.
Out on "the field" single no-kids leaders were always trying to tell us how and when to discipline our kids (like single never married leaders or a priest tring to tell you about how your marriage should be). I was in trouble alot because my standard answer was, "when you have kids, then we'll talk. Otherwise Butt OUT."
I'll never forget when CB and GB finally had a son old enough to attend childrens fellowship and how he cried not to go. I said to C "Different when the shoe is on YOUR foot, isn't it?" She just gave me a look. It was breaking her heart to leave him, I could tell. But she WAS the example, right?
All of those poor nameless little faces being physically assaulted through the years .....All of those parents being taught to abuse by people in authority....people who demanded trust and allegiance, to the point where parents would ignore their own parenting instincts.
IMO I think I was seeking structure after the wild 60's and laid back 70's and as my parents would spank me, I thought I was doing the right thing by physically disciplineing my kids. My dad use to make us lie across out beds and wack us with a belt. I never forgot to hug my kids after using the spoon on them. LOL I can't believe I did that and thought it was right. It is amazing that my kids grew up to be healthy, responsible happy adults. I think it is beacuse they knew-know I love them. And now one has a child, he knows how frustrating it is to figure out raising kids - where to draw the line, how to pick your battles. Can't just let them run wild, but can't beat them into submission either.
Kinda like my x-husbands - can't live with 'em, can't shoot them. HAHA But I still love them, even tho they are ex's.
EXACTLY!! TWI leaders never knew how to pick battles. I think they looked for battles!!
Moneyhands proudly tells of flicking his kid's ear for a good hour or two because he wouldn't say "thank you" to someone who cut his hair. This person was also trapped and unable to leave because Moneyhand's wouldn't allow it till his kid said "thank you". I understand teachinng a kid manners, but REALLY, was this necessary??
There's other stuff too, but I won't bore y'all....
Having read the heartrending account of a 3 yr old being smacked ceaslessly in front of the mother untill the child was beside himself...bewildered, terrified, in pain, uncomprehending of the reason for the cruelty or why his mom who should have been protecting him didn`t....I find this along with the other stories here of viscious mistreatment of children to be deeply disturbing.
To minimalize the horror of the abuse administered to these innocent little ones by posting cute little smileys being hit like it is funny or no big deal, I think is bad form.
Guess you`d have to be the parent of a small child to comprehend the betrayal, and the damage inflicted....it goes so much deeper than the physical pain.
I find it heart rending to read about even years after the fact....
I wish that someone had been there to protect those children....I am having avery hard time at the moment not being dissapointed and dissolusioned with a God who stood by while these punishments were being administered in his name.... the justification for the cruelty being backed scripturally.
Twi taught us to ignore our basic parenting instincts....I mean I know it happen in the world........a parent standing by while a partner mistreats a child....afraid to do anything to stop it...
But these were MINISTERS for Gods sake....they were supposed to be instructing us in how to raise our children in a Godly way :-(
We came to believe what they claimed....that they and they alone represented God`s BEST way to do things.....it was a viscious betrayal of trust.
This issue OUGHT to get folks fired up....damn good n mad at the folks who used their position of authority as God`s ministers to instruct parents in cruelty...ministers and leaders who abused children themselves....leaders who moved ministers when discovered to be molesters to new areas....there is PLENTY to be deeply disturbed about here.
Oldiesman. I was beaten by TWI leadership and my parents my entire childhood. Thankfully my skin is too think to be offended by your indifference and denial.
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Catcup
I, too am new to this particular thread. I spent several hours this morning looking through it. While I was never a part of any "initiation" ceremony (tongue in cheek or otherwise) that Evan describ
excathedra
i always hope that god somehow puts children "to sleep" or does something with their brain so they don't feel pain
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Watered Garden
When we were adopting our son, we got everything short of a colonoscopy. Psychological profiles, home visits, four references of people who had known us for a certain length of time.
They checked a lot of stuff, including criminal records.
Somehow these guys slipped through the cracks.
The wooden spoon part really bothers me too.
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excathedra
it probably bothers us so much because the wooden spoon was taught, used and abused in the way
this is what my mother used(but no colors back then) once the ball came off and she never abused us
ps. i don't use a paddle on my son
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ladycat
OM
Sorry, getting in this late. As a Family Corps person, back in the early 80's, not only did I witness the Corps leader smack a 3 year old repeatedly with a spoon on his thigh because he would not say "sorry", but I saw it happen again and again in "Children's Fellowship". This happened in the middle of the Hall as the poor baby cried so hard he was beside himself. He was 3!! The poor mom stood by, as, gosh, this was the Family Corps LEADER, he could not be wrong, could he? This is not love and this was not the correct use of "the rod". I was flat out bullying. Re-write history? No, just telling the truth. I think, OM, you only want to admit to the good you believe you saw. If anyone wishes to re-write history, it's you. The truth hurts sometimes. Deal with it. BUt don't call people liars, even if you don't specifically use that word.
After 5 months in the family corps (7), I told CB & GB to NEVER again hit, reprove physically, use the rod, whatever they wanted to call it, my children. If they were SO disobedient, come get me.
If anyone reads this, has anyone ever reported sexual child abuse in the Indiana campus? SO many threads it's hard to find.
God does heal hearts and minds. Sometimes it takes a long long long time. My son is 28 and is still not over being hit by some stranger. We were stupid to accept it. I am ashamed I did. My son has forgiven but will never forget.
God bless us all!
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rascal
I am so sorry Lady Cat....I can remember that I so envied those corpes kids, those who it appeared were fortunate enough to get to ride their parents spiritual coat tails through the corpes....
I naievly thought...*Gosh how wonderfull to be raised in the word by spiritually sharp parents...those little guys just don`t know how good they have it*
Who knew that they were enduring the vilest of treatment....
I am so ashamed that though unknowing, I facillitated this abuse by my support of this group:-(
Thanks for bringing this back to the top, someone asked me about it recently.
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ladycat
The most ludicrous thing of all is the corps leaders son who was a smart mouth and a bully, too. I caught him somewhere he was not supose to be and told him to please leave. He said "Do you know who my father is?" And I said , Yeah, do you know who MY Father is?" Never saw the rod used in public on THAT behind. No, corps kids had is rough. Between the townies calling them names and the repressed understanding of what-how kids act, they heard it all day long. My kids were little 4 & 5. It was harder for teens. No such thing as spiritual coat tails. Some learned that harder than others.
Out on "the field" single no-kids leaders were always trying to tell us how and when to discipline our kids (like single never married leaders or a priest tring to tell you about how your marriage should be). I was in trouble alot because my standard answer was, "when you have kids, then we'll talk. Otherwise Butt OUT."
I'll never forget when CB and GB finally had a son old enough to attend childrens fellowship and how he cried not to go. I said to C "Different when the shoe is on YOUR foot, isn't it?" She just gave me a look. It was breaking her heart to leave him, I could tell. But she WAS the example, right?
God bless us all!
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rascal
Your story makes me physically ill Lady Cat....
All of those poor nameless little faces being physically assaulted through the years .....All of those parents being taught to abuse by people in authority....people who demanded trust and allegiance, to the point where parents would ignore their own parenting instincts.
It is just sick.
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ladycat
IMO I think I was seeking structure after the wild 60's and laid back 70's and as my parents would spank me, I thought I was doing the right thing by physically disciplineing my kids. My dad use to make us lie across out beds and wack us with a belt. I never forgot to hug my kids after using the spoon on them. LOL I can't believe I did that and thought it was right. It is amazing that my kids grew up to be healthy, responsible happy adults. I think it is beacuse they knew-know I love them. And now one has a child, he knows how frustrating it is to figure out raising kids - where to draw the line, how to pick your battles. Can't just let them run wild, but can't beat them into submission either.
Kinda like my x-husbands - can't live with 'em, can't shoot them. HAHA But I still love them, even tho they are ex's.
God bless us all!!
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Belle
"how to pick your battles..."
EXACTLY!! TWI leaders never knew how to pick battles. I think they looked for battles!!
Moneyhands proudly tells of flicking his kid's ear for a good hour or two because he wouldn't say "thank you" to someone who cut his hair. This person was also trapped and unable to leave because Moneyhand's wouldn't allow it till his kid said "thank you". I understand teachinng a kid manners, but REALLY, was this necessary??
There's other stuff too, but I won't bore y'all....
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Ham
Too bad we can't do the same thing to those idiots..
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coolchef1248 @adelphia.net
ladycat
i think you did the right thing by hugging your kids after the paddling
i did the same thing.
sometimes young ones need a GENTLE reminder
not pain and always make sure they know it is out of love
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oldiesman
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rascal
That is in pretty bad taste considering the suject matter of this heartbreaking thread :-(
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oldiesman
And YOU have GOOD taste?
My friends PIT BULL has better manners.
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rascal
Well yes, but my manners not withstanding.......
Having read the heartrending account of a 3 yr old being smacked ceaslessly in front of the mother untill the child was beside himself...bewildered, terrified, in pain, uncomprehending of the reason for the cruelty or why his mom who should have been protecting him didn`t....I find this along with the other stories here of viscious mistreatment of children to be deeply disturbing.
To minimalize the horror of the abuse administered to these innocent little ones by posting cute little smileys being hit like it is funny or no big deal, I think is bad form.
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oldiesman
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rascal
Guess you`d have to be the parent of a small child to comprehend the betrayal, and the damage inflicted....it goes so much deeper than the physical pain.
I find it heart rending to read about even years after the fact....
I wish that someone had been there to protect those children....I am having avery hard time at the moment not being dissapointed and dissolusioned with a God who stood by while these punishments were being administered in his name.... the justification for the cruelty being backed scripturally.
Twi taught us to ignore our basic parenting instincts....I mean I know it happen in the world........a parent standing by while a partner mistreats a child....afraid to do anything to stop it...
But these were MINISTERS for Gods sake....they were supposed to be instructing us in how to raise our children in a Godly way :-(
We came to believe what they claimed....that they and they alone represented God`s BEST way to do things.....it was a viscious betrayal of trust.
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oldiesman
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rascal
Nope, this in good conscience I will not do.
This issue OUGHT to get folks fired up....damn good n mad at the folks who used their position of authority as God`s ministers to instruct parents in cruelty...ministers and leaders who abused children themselves....leaders who moved ministers when discovered to be molesters to new areas....there is PLENTY to be deeply disturbed about here.
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oldiesman
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Georgio Jessio
Oldiesman. I was beaten by TWI leadership and my parents my entire childhood. Thankfully my skin is too think to be offended by your indifference and denial.
But I will say this : you're not funny.
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Watered Garden
You know, Oldies, I think that last icon is just plain too aggressive and threatening. Please don't be that way!
WG
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oldiesman
WG, the unrelenting accusatory mean-spirited finger-pointing mindset of some is a lot more threatening and aggressive than some animated icons. IMO.
But I'll try to post gentler icons when I can. Thanks.
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Ham
Just a little thought..
Why make YOURSELF the target, unless it is warranted, for one reason or another?
"These folks" are passionate enough about REALITY to bury that dumb foot cult.. personally, I'd stay out of the way..
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