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T-Bone last won the day on September 28

T-Bone had the most liked content!

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About T-Bone

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    Frequently asks the waiter for Corps sponsorship

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    NOT in Rome City anymore
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    My religion? Do i have to pick just one?

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  1. The WAP class is still the main agenda

    Hi Bliss good to “read “ you again! I always enjoy your thought provoking posts. i am so curious as to the retention rate of TWI...and considering how so much of their stuff is just empty promises - I am also curious of grads that do stick around for awhile - just how they keep the “excitement “ level up.
  2. vpw, truths, lies, reasons/motives.

    Thanks, Don’t Worry – but I’ll tell you why your detailed posts resonate with me like The Grateful Dead's Wall of Sound (- caught some of the Long Strange Trip documentary and was absolutely fascinated by all the technical details and work that went into their wall of sound ) - – because your in-depth detailed analysis often has an almost tangible quality to it.....like being at a live concert – where you see, hear and feel it all… why is that important? When a technician is troubleshooting a system it’s like grabbing the brass ring – when you get to put your finger on the problem. “Ah ha, so that’s why this thing failed!...yes that would cause this to do that!” and why is that important? When you understand the cause or causes – you can fix it…or at least know what to do to prevent it from happening again…and with that comes closure. The same holds true when people do bad things…we want to understand why and how it could happen…figure out how to “fix” what can be “fixed” (or healed)…what to do to prevent something like that from happening again…I’m sure a lot of us here on Grease Spot at times have some sort of analytical program running in the back of our minds now and again…ONCE AGAIN we rummage through old events, experiences, conversations, etc. from our time in The Way International – and we notice another detail…realize another factor involved…and come away saying “I won’t get fooled again” …resolve and another taste of closure. honestly.... it bugs the $hit out of me sometimes trying to figure out what made wierwille tick !!!! I think that’s what’s so unsettling for everyone after the Las Vegas mass shooting – so far investigators are stumped as to the shooter’s motive. People want to understand why someone would do that. How do you prevent something like that from happening again? I know realistically you can’t prevent every evil thing from happening – but if there were red flags on mental health issues, lifestyle, behavior pattern…did anyone close to him notice something odd but brushed it off? …something that folks can point a finger at and say “there’s an issue we should have addressed.” NPR on why finding a motive after the Las Vegas shooting matters == == == == Anyway…I’m no psychologist or a medical professional anything …but as a technician I am driven to understand how things work …so I’ll probably drive myself crazy trying to figure out all this stuff…better self-medicate with some Irish Coffee. Love & peace to you Don’t Worry == == == == btw while working on this post Tonto walked by and asked me what I’m doing (she’s busy picking up after a mess I made reorganizing my stuff in our closet – boy, do I have it made…hope she doesn’t see this post ); I gave her a brief rundown of your 2 posts here and she said it’s great having your input as a healthcare professional and also from your perspective as someone who had a high leadership position in TWI…and she wishes you happiness… and I agree with her...you are like a double-barreled shotgun that blasts through the bull$hit of TWI ok boys & girls, your assignment for tonight is to watch shotgun willie
  3. vpw, truths, lies, reasons/motives.

    hmmmm...I see there's a lot more stuff I need to factor into the theory I posted earlier thanks - great post Don't Worry !!!!
  4. vpw, truths, lies, reasons/motives.

    That’s for sure Grace that’s for sure
  5. vpw, truths, lies, reasons/motives.

    WordWolf, I’m sorry it’s taken me some 6 years to get back to you on that - I’ve been busy - honestly didn’t see this till now. I tend to think he may have understood the difference way way back but started in the direction of compromising on things until he was engulfed in a make-believe world. He may have been so excited to learn the things from BG Leonard or others - and thought of what an enterprising operation it could be - that he may have thought it’s no big deal to say these are my ideas or God showed me this stuff since what really matters is “getting this truth out to my people right away”.....it’s funny to recall this - but I actually remember wierwille teaching on I Timothy 4:2 about the conscience seared with a hot iron - and him saying something along the lines of the first time you do something bad you feel awful - then the next time you do it - it doesn’t feel as bad - eventually your conscience is cauterized - - you feel nothing. Probably ought to factor in a lust for fame, fortune, power and pleasure that would make it easier (more slippery) to cross the lines of honesty and decency. But who knows I’m just guessing how I would “get there from here” if it was me. I try not to demonize him as always being so megalomaniac-ish but rather give him the benefit of a doubt. Perhaps he never intended to spin a complex web of deceit that would eventually trap him in a delusional world that he himself created.
  6. 90s Kid in The Way

    Hi Maya - I agree with Modgellan & Rocky !!!! welcome to Grease Spot ! ! ! I can sort of understand your frustration when dealing with the blindness of a mindset in others...reminds me of that old saying - none are so blind as those who refuse to see.
  7. Stop the Shootings

    Spectrum49, I enjoyed your thoughtful post - - lot’s of good points and thanks for going back to the first post that started this thread; like Rocky I may differ on some of what you covered – which I’ll try to articulate while I also offer my two cents on the issues rrobs addressed in his thread-starter post. Needless to say your post got me to review rrobs’ again – and to have a different approach with what I have to offer now. rrobs certainly picked a hot topic, especially so soon after the Las Vegas mass shooting – and jam-packed with a cross section of complex issues. In reviewing the post – I dwelled on a number of questions: As a Christian what should be my response to the shootings? As a society what should be our response? What should be the response of our government? Does the Bible offer any practical solutions to real-world problems? I want to apologize in advance for jumping around a bit – but attempting to answer questions many thoughts run parallel…tandem…superimposed…weaving in and out of each other…running in the background then foreground…sorry but that is just the way I think when it comes to complex problem-solving where many things may have to work in concert. It probably annoys the $hit out of most folks…anyway… As far as what’s been said about the need for each person to change in order to start changing the world around them – I get that ! while I do believe my Christian faith is helping me to become a better person – I do NOT believe it makes me any better than anyone else. And to be upfront with you all – it’s probably from my 12 years of experience with a hypocritical, legalistic, pompous, manipulative, deceitful, exploitive supposedly Christian organization known as The Way International that I now am a little wary of any folks who claim they are Christian and talk a good walk and tout their faith as if it were a good housekeeping seal of approval and are dead set on sticking to their dogma. I’ve been ripped off financially, socially, emotionally, business-wise, academic-wise not only by upper leadership in TWI but even by so-called professing Christians not in TWI…I feel I need to say all that so you can understand where I’m coming from with the rest of my post. == == == == In the big picture I’m of the opinion that Romans 13 is saying in God’s sovereignty it is his prerogative to deem earthly governments as a means to manage societies. that's one interpretation of it anyway...you could argue against that viewpoint and against using that to justify any form of government and I might even back down - perhaps I'm just a wishy-washy theologian I dunno …but hey, we’re all part of a fallen race and this is all God has to work with right now...it's one of the many things we've been entrusted with - and like many things it can be used properly...or abused. Something that intrigues me about Romans 13 is that it does not specify that the authorities in power are or should be Christian. I’m cool with that (please see my previous comments ). We do not live in a theocracy – where priests or religious leaders rule in the name of God; our society is comprised of folks of various belief systems; but I believe in order for a government to work all citizens must find some common ground. I think a faith in God had something to do with the founding of our country – as seen in The Declaration of Independence: We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foudation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. I understand the common ground stated in The Declaration of Independence as being the unalienable rights and equality. I know some folks can harp on “God” being mentioned in it until they’re bonded-leather-blue in the face but I tend to think that might take away from what’s really important in that document….hint hint…it’s the people! As a noble experiment our government…our society…newscasters…social media - must keep the conversation going about mass shootings…9 in a church…26 in an elementary school…49 in a nightclub…58 at a country music festival…I’m just mentioning the more recent ones – and not to mention all the lesser known crimes / murders committed with a firearm. mass shootings in America When it comes to the prevalence of guns in our society – I think of two things: you can’t put the genie back in the bottle – but maybe by making smart wishes we can corral it. Call me old fashion but I think government should try to honor the wishes of the people. Part of the answer to stop the shootings – or realistically, to make them more difficult to commit is going to be through legislature / our government – and will mean taking on the gun lobbyists among other things besides citizens on both sides of gun-control hashing things out…for starters….besides all the good guys (and gals ) - that's you and me - being ever vigilant. I own several firearms. I have friends who are big into hunting. Throughout my career as a security technician there’s been times when I’ve been licensed to carry a firearm doing double-duty as a security officer as well. I’ve been around firearms most of my adult life. It’s no big deal to me…But a detail with the Las Vegas shooter totally mystifies me – he used several bump-stocks to enable near-fully automatic firepower. The shooter obtained that accessory legally. What is so mystifying to me is that the bump-stock is legal! bump stock - is it legal ? My question is – unless you’re military or law enforcement – what the hell do you need something that approximates a machine gun in rapid firing capacity for?!?! How did something like that get approved by the ATF? Years ago at a gun show I saw something similar – Hellfire Trigger System – and I think they’re still around - Hellfire Trigger System Obviously as a society with our government “in tow” we need to look long and hard at our existing gun laws and procedures for a citizen obtaining a firearm, ammunition, accessories, going to gun ranges, hunting, etc.…Perhaps we will need to consider a major overhaul – similar to airport security evolving since 9/11. Honestly – security and safety is inconvenient if you haven’t realized that already. Yeah there’s passages that indicate the world continues to get worse. But when I read verses like be strong in the Lord and in the power of his might (Ephesians 6:10) or endure hardships as a good soldier of Jesus Christ (II Timothy 2:3) – I’m thinking now is NOT the time to roll over and give up. We need the good guys (and gals ) to stay tough ! One final thing I wanted to mention was to counter the bad rap rrobs was giving the news media. The news media helps keep me connected to the world in a number of ways and helps me prepare for what’s ahead. Like the Equifax hack…pain in the a$$ to hear about that – but the smart thing is to take the necessary steps to thwart the bad guys – so I had my accounts at the credit bureaus frozen for $10 each….I hear about home invasions in the news…so I have a firearm handy when I’m at home (but still keep it inaccessible to any kids around) – when I’m out , my pistol is with me and my other firearms at home are locked up and hidden. You can look at the crimes and dangers on the news and let fear eat at you – or you can channel that fear into doing something smart about it...making the safety and security of you and your family a priority...get involved in your community to promote awareness and address security and safety concerns...be an involved citizen, let your elected officials know what you think - stay up on the issues and vote for change, following the dictates of your conscience....Proverbs 22:3 says, A prudent person foresees danger and takes precautions. The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences…. NLT
  8. Stop the Shootings

    sorry - you're right right - I should have said "you have often refused to negotiate...etc."...I can tell your thought process is changing...speaking for myself - you've never ruffled any of my feathers...and quite frankly we've all laid a few eggs here.
  9. Stop the Shootings

    rrobs: Thanks for the tip, but I don't think the Bible needs to be argued over. I'm not into apologetics. T-Bone: Yet you persist in trying to persuade others that you have made a valid point by your vague sweeping generalization of the Bible...at best this is vague apologetics. == == == == rrobs: …are you telling me you don't know the general message of the Bible? T-Bone: I was going to ask you what is your idea of the general message of the Bible – but I see you answered that in the next sentence. == == == rrobs: I think it says things generally go better when aligned with the Bible as opposed to going against it, which society for the most part, does. T-Bone: It seems you have a rather rigid and legalistic viewpoint of the Bible – perhaps you could give specific passages to back up your assertion; since your claim “it says” refers to the whole Bible – I think you’ll have to provide an exhaustive list of passages rather than proof-texting to establish what you are proposing… ...another thing that came to mind after I read your statement is Matthew 5:45 speaking of the benevolence of God to all – For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust....my point is - Matthew 5:45 seems to go counter to your idea of the general message of the Bible. == == == = = rrobs: All IMO, but I doubt I'm alone in my assessment. I'm also trying real hard to see how the methods of argument people make here are much different than mine. Other than being on flip sides of the coin, they seem pretty much alike. T-Bone: Perhaps you need to try a little harder to see the difference between your methods and many others here - because there is a BIG difference!.... Besides making vague sweeping generalizations and proof-texting (as mentioned above - although you very rarely provide any texts to prove a point) - you frequently appeal to ignorance by attempting to use other folks supposed inability to disprove your “conclusions” as proof of the validity of your conclusion. I don’t recall that being a popular way to debate around here...once again the onus is on the one making a claim to provide scriptural support for the claim - then the ball goes back into the opponent's court to argue whether or not the passages cited are relevant to supporting the claim. Another thing is the all-or-nothing tactic that you resort to when challenged. Case in point: in your reply to Twinky on October 6th you said “The statements I made need no clarification. Excuse me for saying it, but "they say what they mean, and they mean what they say," but that is really the best way I can put it. There are two kinds of people, those who believe what I said and those who don't. I do, others don't. Not much more to say about it.” You refuse to negotiate or even acknowledge there’s other alternatives, options or the possibility that your idea is faulty – besides the fact that you refused to give scripture references for your assertions…and I could go on…but maybe you should think about these obvious differences between your methods and the others that you refer to. == == == == rrobs: The Bereans didn't demand Paul back up all his claims (Acts 17:11). They searched the scriptures daily to see if what Paul said was true or not. They were more noble than the Thessalonians who wanted to string him up. T-Bone: I think Paul’s usual strategy was to appeal to the Old Testament passages that proved Jesus is the Messiah. granted, everyone didn't have a printed version of their own Old Testament - and being aware of Paul's knowledge and retention of scripture he probably referred to Old Testament passages that spoke of the Messiah...if hearers wanted to check on the veracity of Paul's claims - they probably would head to a local synagogue or someplace where scrolls of the Old Testament "books" were kept - so they could review the passages that Paul referred to. in effect, Paul provided scripture to back up his claims given what was available at the time - although for us having printed Bibles, Internet, eBooks of Bibles on devices, etc. - our approach to checking on a reference is by far much quicker....My point is that the standards for arguments, teaching, etc. back then were probably similar to those of modern day academics. It seems kind of silly for you to suggest that we should let you off the hook so you don’t have to provide scripture references because the Bereans didn’t demand that of Paul. You sabotage your own argument by admitting the Bereans did indeed search the scriptures (the Old Testament) to see for themselves if what Paul said about Jesus the Messiah was true. I dare say the Bereans are perhaps a good model of how to study the Bible…as The Moody Bible Commentary puts it – they approached Paul’s teaching with some open-mindedness, they were objective in their evaluation of his message, and they judged his message by the standard of scripture rather than preconceived prejudices. Your posts have been a far cry from Paul’s method of argument as well…and I think it’s fair to say many posters here have tried to help you to clarify your message a-la-Berean style but you have consistently short-circuited the process by dodging simple requests for supporting scripture. And another thing – when I said “This is NOT a Christian or religious website/doctrinal forum.” You replied with “I guess that is the crux of the matter. My mistake. Take care...” …Yet you continue to make the same mistake by expecting us to respond like an adoring congregation to a consummate preacher - - or to cut you some slack because you claim Paul’s Berean audience made no demands of him?....yeah and on that note - again it makes me wonder about those supposed two Christian websites that you said you posted the same paper - if you even did that...and if you did indeed post the same paper there I am curious about the responses....I am curious to see what kind of "Christian standards" those posters used in evaluating your paper. got links ?
  10. The Destruction of Self--Waydale, circa ?

    Thanks WordWolf for posting the links Catcup, great editorial ! I saved it as a PDF on my Laptop in the Grease Spot Lockbox ....uhm...er....I mean Grease Spot folder...great line from your article: "you will see that when a person utilizes the techniques taught in this class, he dismantles his God-given internal warning system of intuition, conscience, and common sense. Out of fear, he refuses to consider outside opposing information." !!!! congrats to you Catcup and wish Kitten the best in cyber-security studies
  11. Stop the Shootings

    Wait - where’re you going? i was going to make espresso
  12. Stop the Shootings

    rrobs: OK. So I at least got half way to approved posting procedures. T-Bone: I’m not aware of any approved posting procedures for Grease Spot…But I think the issue may be that you’re unaware of a typical debate format: someone puts forth a premise, idea, assertion, etc. and provides some kind of evidence or fact that they hope will convince their opponent and/or the audience. == == == == rrobs: But after all this why hasn't anybody told me where my post if off the mark? I know there is no obligation to do so, but if it's that bad, somebody could easily proved me wrong. T-Bone: It’s not a matter of your post being off the mark – when no mark was ever established by you in the first place – if by “mark” you mean being way off the intended target, inaccurate, incorrect, misguided, etc…You’re right, there is no obligation for other posters to correct you – but you did NOT set up a specific "target", nor did you introduce an arguable point for discussion…it looks to me like you introduced an assumption you have (and in my humble opinion there were really quite a few very vague assumptions in your first post). Honestly, how is anyone (other than God almighty) even capable of proving you wrong if we can’t read your mind to see how all your assumptions and Bible knowledge fit together to make your point unassailable? And maybe in your mind the point is unassailable – but you have to give others something of substance (specific appropriate scriptures and logical arguments) to consider in order to test if your point is unassailable. Your post may have some good points and find common ground with others here – but I tend to think folks will shy away from any of that if your points are unfounded – i.e. having no scriptural basis or justification; I was willing to give you a half-a$$ed benefit of a doubt by engaging you on this thread – but wanted something concrete that I could mull over. == == == == rrobs: This could have been settled 3 pages ago had somebody did that. A prosecutor can't just say, "He committed murder," and then have the jury declare the guy guilty. There has to be proof of some kind. I would think that anybody that disagrees with my post should explain why they disagree instead of just saying I offered no proof which is really a dubious claim at best anyway. T-Bone: Three pages ago this thread would have gone in a more interesting and thought-provoking direction if you would have started off with a clear premise, arguable point, or some such debatable issue. Funny you should use the analogy of a prosecuting attorney – that’s how I felt on this thread. But I was not accusing you of asserting a bunch unbiblical stuff – if you recall I selected portions out of your first post that needed proof of some kind, biblical references! I guess you were assuming everything you said was biblically based – and then you wanted others to find passages to prove it wasn’t. That’s like saying you can prove God exists by using only the Bible – “see, it says right here in Genesis, in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” Perhaps I’m a little more liberal in my thought process but I think even Paul drew arguments for the existence of God from other sources like in Romans 1 & 2 – appealing to the existence of the conscience and the order of the cosmos. This isn’t a commercial for the existence of God – I’m merely suggesting Paul may have had a wider audience in mind besides Israel… and perhaps that is something some folks miss when coming to Grease Spot. This is NOT a Christian or religious website/doctrinal forum. If a person wants to preach perhaps they should look for another website. But if one genuinely wants to discuss ideas and the thinking process behind those ideas and be willing to present logical arguments for their viewpoint and listen to counterpoints and debate them – then hey have we got a forum for you! == == == == == rrobs: Doesn't the general message of the Bible carry any weight? Does that general message align with my post or not? So again, where is my post off? If anybody can tell me chapter and verse where I'm off, then I will change my thinking on the matter. As it stands now, I still think the Bible says that a society that believes God is better than one does not believe in God. That is all I was trying to say. True or not true? T-Bone: You ask if the message of the Bible carries any weight – I believe I already answered that – see my previous paragraph – i.e. this is not a Christian website. But perhaps you want to mull over the fine art of debate and read some other threads in doctrinal and questioning faith. Here it may not be so much the status of a work that you reference (that it may or may not be perceived as a holy book) but if one can prove from that text by quoting it or by logical argument that it supports your point. As for your last remarks , “I still think the Bible says that a society that believes God is better than one does not believe in God. That is all I was trying to say. True or not true?” I would have to say you’re referring to a hypothetical situation that’s loaded with assumptions. Better as compared to what? Better – like superior? Better – like preferred?
  13. Evidence: Letters VPW wrote to the Way Corps

    Twinky & Skyrider, How ironic - - I bet wierwille so wanted to hear how folks going into the corps were delivered from all the evil of this world by his ministry - - and here we are ex-corps sharing about being delivered from all the evil of his ministry…that’s gotta be some kind of poetic flip-flop of his delusion…an ego-shattering catastrophic kittywampus-episode or something.
  14. Stop the Shootings

    great point WordWolf I thought the same things - - but to tell you the truth I got tired of playing some run-around game every time I asked for specifics like documentation (chapter and verse) or links to other sites rrobs referred to....I was feeling more like a prosecuting attorney trying to get testimony out of someone rather than having a discussion with an exchange of ideas...my last post to rrobs was more of a simple courtesy of honoring what he said "I believe what I posted.You seem not to. Let's just leave it at that." ....so I left it at that.... by the way - in reference to my parting words "love & peace , T-Bone" that I said to rrobs - I meant that sincerely......and it's probably due to the fact that WordWolf's thread on tone and decorum at Grease Spot still reverberates in my mind and I'm working on being more mellow and courteous in my approach to certain discussions - I know - I've got a long ways to go....but I'm glad someone else pointed out this stuff ....I was beginning to feel like a broken record. anyway....it's too bad we couldn't get beyond all that....I could have really got into a discussion that addresses the Las Vegas mass shooting and the aftermath - in terms of what should be done -- -- I mean after all, the title of this thread is stop the shootings - that's a call to action - i wasn't expecting a rah rah session over pious platitudes - - i thought we'd get into it thoughtfully - not just legislature-wise, but socially, how our country handles mental health issues, how violence is so prevalent in movies and video games, explore the big picture philosophically, the problem of evil in the world and a gazillion other tangents - - - - heck you hear so much of that in the news and social media since the mass shooting...and after every mass shooting as a matter of fact....yeah talk is cheap but it's a step in the right direction - it's a start - it gets people thinking about what they can and should do....I thought that would be the way this thread would go - and develop into a thoughtful conversation....I know Twinky tried to get us going in a meaningful direction by her posts early on but I guess her great points got lost in the noise and distraction of "cross-examination" attempts - - oops that was me!.....sorry for my whining and disappointment - - I really get frustrated when folks either don't want to or can't extrapolate on the practical impact of a doctrine or a belief system.
  15. Evidence: Letters VPW wrote to the Way Corps

    I agree - these corps letters from wierwille are self-incriminating ! It’s a partial peek inside his criminal mind ! You get to see the means and opportunity he had at his disposal - - the only thing hidden is his motive....but I guaren-damn-tee ya it was not love ....any wierwille sycophant who disagrees just compare the way he handled anything with the way love is defined in I Corinthians 13 !!!!!!! I rest my case.