When you get right down to it, there is NO REASON in the frikkin world to carry on about anything to do with that pieceofwork (ha I didn't curse).
People who are leading offshoots based on that very "off" person should be ashamed of themselves.
Well I don't know excie .. are you saying my "Jeffrey Dahmer Eatery" is a bad idea?
But really, how insane are these folks? It does seem they all should be arrested for DUI ... "Doctrinally Under the Influence" ...
OK, that was the best I could do .. maybe there is a better "D word".
I used to agree with you excie, that we did at least learn jet style packing, but really ... who rolls up there clothes? I think anyone that does that is possessed ... homosexuas are OK, but jet style packers are born of the wrong seed.
As for the Corps being at all similar to other ordination training ... despite some perhaps honest attempts by a few, most went out there and became incompetent to counsel, yet they did it anyway. There was almost no legit training ... it was training to sell ... if anyone got training, it was mostly because they read a few books maybe.
I "married" one couple ... I told them some books to read ... I wasn't going to pretend to be able to counsel them.
I sent a bulimic woman to a real counselor and she was healed. I can pat myself on the back for knowing we had no training for that.
Alcoholics I sent to AA ... maybe if i was ordained I could have taught them to drink Drambuie ...
I'm thinking many way ministers may have been guilty of malpractice ... the ego SOME had to try to run people's lives was devastating to many ... and then some were just predators ... or victims that became predators ...
good gawd ... now we have splinters that want to make their father in da wuhrd proud ... yikes ...
I have what some folks would consider a "pseudo-ordination"; I applied for and received an ordination over the internet by The Universal Life Church. I got it in order to perform weddings. I use the title "reverend" only in conjunction with my wedding officiant duties. I don't try to pass myself off as being special or spiritual or worthy of anything out of the ordinary.
Ralph D also brought a guy in once. Great singer, writer, artist. Forgot his name too. nicknamed Junkyard Dog? I'm sorry that I lost track of him too...
"Yard Dog" was a name that Bob Stanley used to go by before he got involved with The Way. Is that what you're thinking of? If I remember correctly he did his first tape independently, but then HQ exerted more control over him and put out a tape that sounded like a Joyful Noise clone. His later stuff with Acts 29 was more youth oriented rock though.
This has certainly been an entertaining and enlightning thread.
Thanks to many including DWBH for some great history.
Someone mentioned they would like to know what has happened in the last several years.
After the fog years LCM got the bright idea that the corps he was now responsible for should be a step up from Vicsters.
It was called WC2 as many here know.
It was sort of out with the old and in with the new.
There was a big purging that went on not only in the whole ministry but also in the corps program.
LCMs excuse was that many of the old grads and old corps were either lazy or didn't have the controntational skills that he wanted. (In other words they wouldn't bend over big enought to kiss his you know what).
The only ordinations that came about in the mid ninties to LCMs demise were those who were his "hit men". They were the ones who could prove they could be as big of a jerk as LCM was. It was all about how many homos or lazy people or those who hadn't given enough ABS that they had searched out and given the boot.
We had some come to our town, they told all us old corps that they were going to show us how to move the word and that because they were in LCM's corps they had gifts in operation. (sort of funny because after they came the word never moved again).
There were only a couple of ordinations in those years.
Since then in Rosie's domain there have been very few.
Now they can't get more than a couple at a time to even go into the program and even then it's the kids of folks who are corps and put the pressure on to further the corporation.
yes, it was bob stanley whose music was pronmoted from "outside" the control of hq.........imo, his stuff was like the early way prod stuff of cookin' mama, pressed down, good seed, and the early years of joyful noise..........his pre-twi nickname was yard dog, and he was into serious punk-rock type stuff prior to twi......and his early twi stuff had a mild edginess to it and the folks in illinois, bob's home state loved him and his music..........unfortunately, bob went into the corps, and last i heard he's still "in" twi down in florida i think.......sad........
polar bear..........i for one, appreciate the info about twi after the fog years, since i left at the beginning of "da fog".........and lcm and geer became increasingly paranoid about any thing they were doing being communicated to us "cop outs", let alone the few of us "seed boys" who were vocal about what the "fog" was really all about!......i have no knowledge of what twi was like after 1989, other than that which i obtained from waydale, here at the spot, and conversations i've had with those who were stuck in twi during the 90's and beyond........so, thanks to all who have provided that kind of info.........and, please........keep it coming!................peace.
Question: Wasn't all of New Horizons allowed to go in rez all together - just to keep the group together?
I don't want to get too far off track here, but I don't believe all the guys went into the same corps. J@mes $mith (a nicer man you would never meet) ended up in KS, R@n H*rst went into the 13th, and I don't know about B*rl@n Du*l and the fourth guy (darned if I can remember his name). But they did have a nice sound and they clearly enjoyed what they were doing on stage and their enthusiasm was infectious.
As for ordinations, a group of 18th corps were ordained very early in our "careers" as corps... M!ke And*rs@on, R!c@ M@gn*ll! and a few others... none of us were surprised as these guys had been marked out and given sweet leadership spots all through in-rez and after... more 18th ordinations came later... these guys were absolutely trained to be craig's watchdogs and henchmen! and it was usually obvious why they got the "promotion".
As for ordinations, a group of 18th corps were ordained very early in our "careers" as corps... M!ke And*rs@on, R!c@ M@gn*ll! and a few others... none of us were surprised as these guys had been marked out and given sweet leadership spots all through in-rez and after... more 18th ordinations came later... these guys were absolutely trained to be craig's watchdogs and henchmen! and it was usually obvious why they got the "promotion".
This sickens me.
How the title "Rev" became equivalent with "henchman."
I don't want to get too far off track here, but I don't believe all the guys went into the same corps. J@mes $mith (a nicer man you would never meet) ended up in KS, R@n H*rst went into the 13th, and I don't know about B*rl@n Du*l and the fourth guy (darned if I can remember his name). But they did have a nice sound and they clearly enjoyed what they were doing on stage and their enthusiasm was infectious.
As for ordinations, a group of 18th corps were ordained very early in our "careers" as corps... M!ke And*rs@on, R!c@ M@gn*ll! and a few others... none of us were surprised as these guys had been marked out and given sweet leadership spots all through in-rez and after... more 18th ordinations came later... these guys were absolutely trained to be craig's watchdogs and henchmen! and it was usually obvious why they got the "promotion".
Last I know James is still here in Topeka. He had a kidney removed about a year ago.
This thread healed me. I've been wondering about this subject for decades, and now I know how the clergy thing worked in TWI. Thank you all for posting -- not just for myself, but for all the other newbies. Especially you, DontWorryBeHappy.
When I left in 1976 it was just me. For years, I didn't have anybody to talk to about it. Trying to explain TWI to somebody who had not experienced it first-hand was not very helpful, or easy.
Being on staff was a real eye opener for me. I was oblivious regarding the scandalous stuff, but I was painfully aware of the legalism and the poor choices VPW often made when putting people in charge of departments and events. Some of the meanest, most legalistic, most arrogant people I had to deal with were ordained clergy, so unless there's a gift ministry of Big Mean DumbA$$, something was wrong somewhere.
I haven't laughed until I cried in a long time, Linda Z. Thanks for that paragraph!
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GrouchoMarxJr
Being ordained by Vic the flim flam man was like ...
... receiving a doctor's degree from Pikes Peak seminary...
I've heard that after the ordination was complete, there was an un-natural desire to bathe and scrub.
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waysider
A Letter Of Recommendation from Bealzabub.
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wing
That is funny!
Reminds me of my buddy, he sent in for an ordination from -yes- the back of a match book cover.
They sent him a certificate. He used it to start up a prison fellowship ... way back when. It was even a TWI thing.
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excathedra
When you get right down to it, there is NO REASON in the frikkin world to carry on about anything to do with that pieceofwork (ha I didn't curse).
People who are leading offshoots based on that very "off" person should be ashamed of themselves.
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rhino
Well I don't know excie .. are you saying my "Jeffrey Dahmer Eatery" is a bad idea?
But really, how insane are these folks? It does seem they all should be arrested for DUI ... "Doctrinally Under the Influence" ...
OK, that was the best I could do .. maybe there is a better "D word".
I used to agree with you excie, that we did at least learn jet style packing, but really ... who rolls up there clothes? I think anyone that does that is possessed ... homosexuas are OK, but jet style packers are born of the wrong seed.
As for the Corps being at all similar to other ordination training ... despite some perhaps honest attempts by a few, most went out there and became incompetent to counsel, yet they did it anyway. There was almost no legit training ... it was training to sell ... if anyone got training, it was mostly because they read a few books maybe.
I "married" one couple ... I told them some books to read ... I wasn't going to pretend to be able to counsel them.
I sent a bulimic woman to a real counselor and she was healed.
I can pat myself on the back for knowing we had no training for that.
Alcoholics I sent to AA ... maybe if i was ordained I could have taught them to drink Drambuie ...
I'm thinking many way ministers may have been guilty of malpractice ... the ego SOME had to try to run people's lives was devastating to many ... and then some were just predators ... or victims that became predators ...
good gawd ... now we have splinters that want to make their father in da wuhrd proud ... yikes ...
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doojable
Question:
Wasn't all of New Horizons allowed to go in rez all together - just to keep the group together?
Comment on ordination:
So here you have these pseudo-ordained men running around - some of them starting their own mini-cults and ordaining even more...
What's that they say about a copy of a copy? Things start to deteriorate...rapidly.
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excathedra
"Doctrinally Under the Influence" ...
How 'bout "Influenced Under the Dick (Doctrinal Doctor Dick)"
IUD?
I'm also thinking, anyone who can fold their crap up into compartments, qualifies for ordination
I want to make it clear I'm not talking about goodhearted real genuine people like some of you here
But I stand by my thoughts of veepee being a horrible excuse for anyone thinking they were ordained of God because of him
I have no problem if you think God called you to something, just don't put that bastud into the mix
for me anyway
Sorry if I haven't explain myself well
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excathedra
I think God and Jesus Christ can reach into the pit of hell. For that I'm thankful. But I ain't staying in the pit.
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Mark Clarke
But isn't that what TWI really stands for? -- Teaching While Intoxicated ?!!
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Oakspear
I have what some folks would consider a "pseudo-ordination"; I applied for and received an ordination over the internet by The Universal Life Church. I got it in order to perform weddings. I use the title "reverend" only in conjunction with my wedding officiant duties. I don't try to pass myself off as being special or spiritual or worthy of anything out of the ordinary.
And I have this cool laminated card
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T-Bone
Listening with a purpose questions
Name some of the ways to get ordained discussed on this thread?
T-Bone writes
TWI flim flam method
Send off from the back of a matchbook cover
Over the Internet
[edited by the right reverend so-and-so over some spacing details]
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wing
Sorry dooj .... I don't know anything about that. Seems to me like they didn't stay around for very long.
thanks again for helping out with the name.
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Mark Clarke
"Yard Dog" was a name that Bob Stanley used to go by before he got involved with The Way. Is that what you're thinking of? If I remember correctly he did his first tape independently, but then HQ exerted more control over him and put out a tape that sounded like a Joyful Noise clone. His later stuff with Acts 29 was more youth oriented rock though.
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wing
Mark...
I dunno. could've been Bob. He played an evening of his own stuff at the way CULTural center (the old church in new bremen).
You may be right about yarddog, instead of junkyard dog. He told a story about the nickname at that show, a dog that protects a junkyard?
I wouln't have a clue about the sound of a second recording (he did ask me to play some mandolin for him at a recording session,
that was to take place up north -chicago, or maybe in michigan - I passed on the invite for... I don't remember why).
I don't know anything at all about an Acts 29, ... I was probably long gone.
Don'tWorryBeHappy would likely remember at least his name, ... if he sees this and wants to chime in.
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polar bear
Bob Stanely was a rocker for sure.
This has certainly been an entertaining and enlightning thread.
Thanks to many including DWBH for some great history.
Someone mentioned they would like to know what has happened in the last several years.
After the fog years LCM got the bright idea that the corps he was now responsible for should be a step up from Vicsters.
It was called WC2 as many here know.
It was sort of out with the old and in with the new.
There was a big purging that went on not only in the whole ministry but also in the corps program.
LCMs excuse was that many of the old grads and old corps were either lazy or didn't have the controntational skills that he wanted. (In other words they wouldn't bend over big enought to kiss his you know what).
The only ordinations that came about in the mid ninties to LCMs demise were those who were his "hit men". They were the ones who could prove they could be as big of a jerk as LCM was. It was all about how many homos or lazy people or those who hadn't given enough ABS that they had searched out and given the boot.
We had some come to our town, they told all us old corps that they were going to show us how to move the word and that because they were in LCM's corps they had gifts in operation. (sort of funny because after they came the word never moved again).
There were only a couple of ordinations in those years.
Since then in Rosie's domain there have been very few.
Now they can't get more than a couple at a time to even go into the program and even then it's the kids of folks who are corps and put the pressure on to further the corporation.
Just a few thoughts, hope it helps.
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DontWorryBeHappy
hi all you greasespotters!........
yes, it was bob stanley whose music was pronmoted from "outside" the control of hq.........imo, his stuff was like the early way prod stuff of cookin' mama, pressed down, good seed, and the early years of joyful noise..........his pre-twi nickname was yard dog, and he was into serious punk-rock type stuff prior to twi......and his early twi stuff had a mild edginess to it and the folks in illinois, bob's home state loved him and his music..........unfortunately, bob went into the corps, and last i heard he's still "in" twi down in florida i think.......sad........
polar bear..........i for one, appreciate the info about twi after the fog years, since i left at the beginning of "da fog".........and lcm and geer became increasingly paranoid about any thing they were doing being communicated to us "cop outs", let alone the few of us "seed boys" who were vocal about what the "fog" was really all about!......i have no knowledge of what twi was like after 1989, other than that which i obtained from waydale, here at the spot, and conversations i've had with those who were stuck in twi during the 90's and beyond........so, thanks to all who have provided that kind of info.........and, please........keep it coming!................peace.
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TheHighWay
I don't want to get too far off track here, but I don't believe all the guys went into the same corps. J@mes $mith (a nicer man you would never meet) ended up in KS, R@n H*rst went into the 13th, and I don't know about B*rl@n Du*l and the fourth guy (darned if I can remember his name). But they did have a nice sound and they clearly enjoyed what they were doing on stage and their enthusiasm was infectious.
As for ordinations, a group of 18th corps were ordained very early in our "careers" as corps... M!ke And*rs@on, R!c@ M@gn*ll! and a few others... none of us were surprised as these guys had been marked out and given sweet leadership spots all through in-rez and after... more 18th ordinations came later... these guys were absolutely trained to be craig's watchdogs and henchmen! and it was usually obvious why they got the "promotion".
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doojable
This sickens me.
How the title "Rev" became equivalent with "henchman."
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DogLover
The Highway stated: R@n H*rst went into the 13th.
I humbly disagree. I was in the 13th Corps and he was not in it. As I recall, he was in the 14th.
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WhiteDove
Last I know James is still here in Topeka. He had a kidney removed about a year ago.
Here
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TheHighWay
Ooh... you are absolutely right, DL... got my years mixed up
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fooledagainII
Is this the same J@mes Sm*th that suffered from a stroke sometime back?
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OperaBuff
This thread healed me. I've been wondering about this subject for decades, and now I know how the clergy thing worked in TWI. Thank you all for posting -- not just for myself, but for all the other newbies. Especially you, DontWorryBeHappy.
When I left in 1976 it was just me. For years, I didn't have anybody to talk to about it. Trying to explain TWI to somebody who had not experienced it first-hand was not very helpful, or easy.
I haven't laughed until I cried in a long time, Linda Z. Thanks for that paragraph!
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mchud11
Thanks for the reference, have been curious about L%^ D*^%$@@son for some time, she was my WOW branch leader in Nashville, thanks...
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