wow, that's a good question, we were taught to but all our questions in a file and not think of them again.
I think I fuddled with "dead not alive/trinty" garbage a little, cause that was the "up front" beliefs . . . the ones they push so you don't think about the others
when the law of believing went I think I started to see these beliefs in layers.
When I was in leadership always said that when people left, the first breakdown in their devil-spirit infested minds was to start believing the dead are alive.
Yeah...really horrible to believe eternal life means eternal life.....and we belong to God always...to have some hope.
What an empty, cold, faithless,(did I say empty?) and hopeless gospel they cleave to. ..
The very first to go was that the "original sin of mankind" was that the Devil had lesbian sex with Eve; I don't think that I ever 100% bought into it though!
A lot the first batch of things to go were from Martindale's WayAP class. He had a whole segment on the "Face of the Deep" where he goes on about how the Devil and his angels, after being kicked out of heaven, went to the edge of the universe, the face of the deep, where the waters that supposedly surrounded the universe where, and due to the Devil & his minions being bereft of light and light being a form of heat, the waters were frozen.
This was supposedly what really" happened between Genesis 1:1 & 1:2. While I was still "in" I did a teaching about the so-called gap at fellowship one night. I don't remember what the details were or if it's even "right", but it was completely at odds with what Martindale taught. After I was done, several people remarked that it made sense and that they hadn't really understood what was taught in WayAP.
I guess other than Martindale's wacky stuff the things that went first were the belief that The Way had any claim to be God's ministry or a source of truth, that leaders of The Way were God's spokesmen, that the keys to research were any guarantee to reaching the truth, that I needed a "ministry" to get me closer to the divine...
Yeah...really horrible to believe eternal life means eternal life.....and we belong to God always...to have some hope.
What an empty, cold, faithless,(did I say empty?) and hopeless gospel they cleave to. ..
Maybe you and I are on a different wave length.----I dunno.
I didn't interpret JJ's post to be disparaging anyone's belief in eternal life. Rather, I saw it as a specific questioning of the whole soul-sleep concept.
I actually do believe that there is an afterlife now, but it only came after being out for over a year. I've almost trashed all of the twi beliefs I had. I would say I am Christian with some Buddhist overtones. So, really, I don't think there is a word to describe my belief system... But I do believe in God and Jesus. I apologize if I offended anyone. I do not believe in disparaging anyone's personal beliefs (twi excepted... Becuase the belief system is based on a self serving evil man and is run as a corporation to only get people's money.)
Maybe you and I are on a different wave length.----I dunno.
I didn't interpret JJ's post to be disparaging anyone's belief in eternal life. Rather, I saw it as a specific questioning of the whole soul-sleep concept.
I didn't see her post that way either...but, I actually WAS disparaging TWI for their comment about devil spirit infested minds because people believe the dead are alive......seems sad.
I didn't see her post that way either...but, I actually WAS disparaging TWI for their comment about devil spirit infested minds because people believe the dead are alive......seems sad.
It is sad because they are so caustic and polarizing with what they believe. Whether it's true or not.
When I was in leadership always said that when people left, the first breakdown in their devil-spirit infested minds was to start believing the dead are alive.
That's a change in teaching from what was taught in the 70's and 80's. In the NEW DYNAMIC CHURCH VP said the first thing to go was to turn away from the Man of God.
The very first to go was that the "original sin of mankind" was that the Devil had lesbian sex with Eve; I don't think that I ever 100% bought into it though!
That is also different from what was taught in the 70's and 80's. In CF&S VP taught the original sin was sexual self-gratification. Must've been "new light" for LCM later.
The first thing to go for me was TWI's teaching on Eli Eli lama etc. I can't remember who posted it on GSC, but someone said they learned an alternative translation which, surprisingly enough, was "...why hast thou forsaken me." This same person said she contacted someone from the "Research" Department who said they knew about it and yet no changes were made to any materials, no aerticles in GMIR or the Way Mag...nothing. I e-mailed John S. asking about this translation and he said it was true.
I started thinking about V.P.'s vision at the gas pumps, and how God supposidely taught VP the Word greater than it's been known since the first century. Well, God must have blown it on this one or maybe V.P. never had the revelation in the first place. Wierwille taught this so adamantly in PLAF, but now that he was proven wrong, it was hush hush. That started me thinking what else he might have been wrong about.
I don't remember the woman's name, but thank you if you're reading this.
First thing I threw out was that TWI is an organization dedicated to following Christian principles. That all of them would behave in accordance with scriptures. That they would live a Godly life.
When I found out about the adulterous behavior and the vile personal life of LCM (thanks, Grease Spot Cafe) it was easy to see how all the rest of their treatment of other human beings (especially their own followers) was RIGHT OFF and to reject anything they said about personal relationships ... of any kind.
It wasn't the first thing to go for me, but it seems the most ironic, looking back. All the hours and hours picking up litter around the root locations, based on the idea that devil spirits like to hang out around trash. HQ always looked immaculate, yet it seems there were more devil spirits hanging out there than anywhere else! That is, assuming what they taught about devil spirits was true. Which it wasn't.
That other Christians including my own extended earthly family were somehow inferior.
That it is excusable behavior for TWI leadership to act towards other human beings worse than anything you'd experience in a normal society or business because they are "called of God" or "ordained of God".
It wasn't the first thing to go for me, but it seems the most ironic, looking back. All the hours and hours picking up litter around the root locations, based on the idea that devil spirits like to hang out around trash. HQ always looked immaculate, yet it seems there were more devil spirits hanging out there than anywhere else! That is, assuming what they taught about devil spirits was true. Which it wasn't.
Love,
Steve
I don't know... I'm pretty sure New Knoxville was built over the gateway to hell.
The first TWI belief to go... for me there were two of them, and they went before I left TWI. They were part of the reasons why I was ready to leave TWI long before all the Dung hit the fan..
The first one, which I never bought from the day I took PFAL, was the belief that the Ministry had all the answeres and I didn't need to study my own bible. That I needed to just take their word for it, and believe every thing they said, oh and study the class material, Weirwille had done all the work already I just needed to study the PFAL material.. this always seemed sucha contradiction from the bible verse they hammered into us about study to show thy self approved unto God, a workman rightly dividing the word of truth.
The second one was the notion that all my Abundant Sharing needed to go to the mInistry only .. that somehow I had no Idea how to share my abundance with the believers and that only Head Quarters knew really where my money needed to go.. and God couldn't possibly be inspiring me to give my money to someone I saw who needed it..
Next to go, when we actually left, was the notion that if we left, we would be walking out from under the protection of God by leaving the ministry.. Yeah Right.... Really... I am still living and much happier and healthier.
I am sad to say it has taken me much longer to eradicate the rest... all of which I attribute to Grease spot and all the information here that has helped me find out the truth about The Way International and its lies and detrimental practices.
By the way I never bought that whole teaching that "when it comes to the word I have no friends" Malarky, and when I heard Weirwille touting that doctrine along with the whole notion that Gods word would seperate me from family and friends, with my own ears, I sholud have run away.... and I kick myself now.
Although not technically a belief, the dogma that leadership walked and made decisions by some extra-special revelation. And that the revelation was so good that rank-and-file must not question it.
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OldSkool
Jesus Christ is not the absent Christ.
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JavaJane
Good one. I had forgotten about that teaching. So weird...
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Bolshevik
wow, that's a good question, we were taught to but all our questions in a file and not think of them again.
I think I fuddled with "dead not alive/trinty" garbage a little, cause that was the "up front" beliefs . . . the ones they push so you don't think about the others
when the law of believing went I think I started to see these beliefs in layers.
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GrouchoMarxJr
I suppose the first twi belief to go was indeed...the "law" of believing.
once I knew that was phoney, the rest of it crumbled like a house of cards.
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potato
"believers" aren't "the best".
ceasing to tithe does not rain down tragedy on my family.
I don't "know that I know that I know" and nobody in their right mind does.
those three came about in quick succession and then I was able to escape.
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waysider
I'm not sure I can catalog it into any kind of tidy chronology. It's all been, and continues to be, an evolutionary process for me.
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geisha779
Yeah...really horrible to believe eternal life means eternal life.....and we belong to God always...to have some hope.
What an empty, cold, faithless,(did I say empty?) and hopeless gospel they cleave to. ..
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Oakspear
The very first to go was that the "original sin of mankind" was that the Devil had lesbian sex with Eve; I don't think that I ever 100% bought into it though!
A lot the first batch of things to go were from Martindale's WayAP class. He had a whole segment on the "Face of the Deep" where he goes on about how the Devil and his angels, after being kicked out of heaven, went to the edge of the universe, the face of the deep, where the waters that supposedly surrounded the universe where, and due to the Devil & his minions being bereft of light and light being a form of heat, the waters were frozen.
This was supposedly what really" happened between Genesis 1:1 & 1:2. While I was still "in" I did a teaching about the so-called gap at fellowship one night. I don't remember what the details were or if it's even "right", but it was completely at odds with what Martindale taught. After I was done, several people remarked that it made sense and that they hadn't really understood what was taught in WayAP.
I guess other than Martindale's wacky stuff the things that went first were the belief that The Way had any claim to be God's ministry or a source of truth, that leaders of The Way were God's spokesmen, that the keys to research were any guarantee to reaching the truth, that I needed a "ministry" to get me closer to the divine...
The rest were just details...
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waysider
Maybe you and I are on a different wave length.----I dunno.
I didn't interpret JJ's post to be disparaging anyone's belief in eternal life. Rather, I saw it as a specific questioning of the whole soul-sleep concept.
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JavaJane
I actually do believe that there is an afterlife now, but it only came after being out for over a year. I've almost trashed all of the twi beliefs I had. I would say I am Christian with some Buddhist overtones. So, really, I don't think there is a word to describe my belief system... But I do believe in God and Jesus. I apologize if I offended anyone. I do not believe in disparaging anyone's personal beliefs (twi excepted... Becuase the belief system is based on a self serving evil man and is run as a corporation to only get people's money.)
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geisha779
I didn't see her post that way either...but, I actually WAS disparaging TWI for their comment about devil spirit infested minds because people believe the dead are alive......seems sad.
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OldSkool
It is sad because they are so caustic and polarizing with what they believe. Whether it's true or not.
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Broken Arrow
That's a change in teaching from what was taught in the 70's and 80's. In the NEW DYNAMIC CHURCH VP said the first thing to go was to turn away from the Man of God.
That is also different from what was taught in the 70's and 80's. In CF&S VP taught the original sin was sexual self-gratification. Must've been "new light" for LCM later.
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OldSkool
You really gotta watch that new light from LCM -
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Broken Arrow
The first thing to go for me was TWI's teaching on Eli Eli lama etc. I can't remember who posted it on GSC, but someone said they learned an alternative translation which, surprisingly enough, was "...why hast thou forsaken me." This same person said she contacted someone from the "Research" Department who said they knew about it and yet no changes were made to any materials, no aerticles in GMIR or the Way Mag...nothing. I e-mailed John S. asking about this translation and he said it was true.
I started thinking about V.P.'s vision at the gas pumps, and how God supposidely taught VP the Word greater than it's been known since the first century. Well, God must have blown it on this one or maybe V.P. never had the revelation in the first place. Wierwille taught this so adamantly in PLAF, but now that he was proven wrong, it was hush hush. That started me thinking what else he might have been wrong about.
I don't remember the woman's name, but thank you if you're reading this.
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Tzaia
Absent Christ followed by praying and worshiping Jesus is not idolatry. Law of Believing. Then Body - Soul - Spirit. Dispensations<-- recent
Things I never bought into:
Tithe
Devil possession
The "household"
Things I no longer care about:
Trinity or not - this was huge
Whether dead is dead
bible inerrancy
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Twinky
First thing I threw out was that TWI is an organization dedicated to following Christian principles. That all of them would behave in accordance with scriptures. That they would live a Godly life.
When I found out about the adulterous behavior and the vile personal life of LCM (thanks, Grease Spot Cafe) it was easy to see how all the rest of their treatment of other human beings (especially their own followers) was RIGHT OFF and to reject anything they said about personal relationships ... of any kind.
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newlife
First thing to go for me was the Law of Believing....That lifted a huge weight off my shoulders
The next was the "absent Christ"--who is not absent at all
and from there it's been a list of them that have been tossed out
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Steve Lortz
It wasn't the first thing to go for me, but it seems the most ironic, looking back. All the hours and hours picking up litter around the root locations, based on the idea that devil spirits like to hang out around trash. HQ always looked immaculate, yet it seems there were more devil spirits hanging out there than anywhere else! That is, assuming what they taught about devil spirits was true. Which it wasn't.
Love,
Steve
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chockfull
That other Christians including my own extended earthly family were somehow inferior.
That it is excusable behavior for TWI leadership to act towards other human beings worse than anything you'd experience in a normal society or business because they are "called of God" or "ordained of God".
That they deserved my money.
That they deserved my loyalty.
That they ever had my best interests in mind.
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JavaJane
I don't know... I'm pretty sure New Knoxville was built over the gateway to hell.
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leafytwiglet
The first TWI belief to go... for me there were two of them, and they went before I left TWI. They were part of the reasons why I was ready to leave TWI long before all the Dung hit the fan..
The first one, which I never bought from the day I took PFAL, was the belief that the Ministry had all the answeres and I didn't need to study my own bible. That I needed to just take their word for it, and believe every thing they said, oh and study the class material, Weirwille had done all the work already I just needed to study the PFAL material.. this always seemed sucha contradiction from the bible verse they hammered into us about study to show thy self approved unto God, a workman rightly dividing the word of truth.
The second one was the notion that all my Abundant Sharing needed to go to the mInistry only .. that somehow I had no Idea how to share my abundance with the believers and that only Head Quarters knew really where my money needed to go.. and God couldn't possibly be inspiring me to give my money to someone I saw who needed it..
Next to go, when we actually left, was the notion that if we left, we would be walking out from under the protection of God by leaving the ministry.. Yeah Right.... Really... I am still living and much happier and healthier.
I am sad to say it has taken me much longer to eradicate the rest... all of which I attribute to Grease spot and all the information here that has helped me find out the truth about The Way International and its lies and detrimental practices.
By the way I never bought that whole teaching that "when it comes to the word I have no friends" Malarky, and when I heard Weirwille touting that doctrine along with the whole notion that Gods word would seperate me from family and friends, with my own ears, I sholud have run away.... and I kick myself now.
Edited for Clarity
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Oakspear
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Jim
Although not technically a belief, the dogma that leadership walked and made decisions by some extra-special revelation. And that the revelation was so good that rank-and-file must not question it.
That and the "law" of believing.
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