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Posted (edited)
On 5/11/2022 at 1:24 AM, WordWolf said:

In making up this story from whole cloth, what did vpw accomplish?

A) He made Jesus Christ sound more like a maverick.  Since vpw fancied himself a maverick (go over his own accounts of how he handled his first pastorate if you need proof), he tried to make JC sound more like himself.  

B) He made The Establishment sound WRONG.   Again, putting Religious Authorities on one side, and himself and Right on the other side.

C) He made it sound like all other Christian teachers were WRONG- and you could only trust HIM to get it right. 

 

All of that was part of vpw's campaign to carve out his own little empire among the young Christians.  From the beginning, he'd preferred older Christians with money, but he wasn't able to impress them, he was able to fool the young and naive.  So, he slowly tried to assemble the parts of a machine that would allow him to fleece a flock of young Christians.    When his machine was ready, he still couldn't do it- until he heard about the Christian hippies of the House of Acts.  He arrived there and did his full act- in between things like asking what orgies were like and saying God was ok with orgies-  and manage to impress a handful of genuine Christians who were naive, and used them as his recruiting arm all through the 1970s.

My take-away from this actual manufactured error is vic's glaring hypocrisy and deeply flawed research methodology.

Vic claimed to be a Bible literalist and represented himself as a skilled exegete and textual critic, one who arrived at accuracy through exhaustive, precise "research." He constantly rebukes any other interpretation as eisegetical, "private," opinionated, and inaccurate.

HOWEVER, here he does exactly what he preaches against: Reading into a text something that doesn't exist. Now, there are theological, Christological, and historical arguments about who Jesus' earthly father is and all the attendant implications historically, religiously, spiritually. Victor doesn't develop any of these arguments here. Perhaps he doesn't really understand how (H-O-W), perhaps he's too lazy, perhaps he's too stupid or "spiritually immature."

He is hoping the viewer/reader/listener just won't notice, that they will be too intellectually fatigued from all the repetitive droning. Or that they will be so impressed with the novelty, they will BELIEVE the amazing bull$hit. It's sleight of hand. It's dishonest "research." Its magic. It's hypocrisy.

Who would accept any claim of fact about something as serious as The Word of God if anyone made it with: I heard about it somewhere, can't remember where, it's not in the text, but it can be, if you make it fit. Why would one believe this? Who would even utter such an idea? This is insanity. This is your sign!

This is only one of many, many self-contradictions in PFAL and collaterals.

PFALToday has an ethical, intellectual and spiritual responsibility to correct this and all other errors. Mere omission of an error is not a correction.

Edited by Nathan_Jr
Scientifically precise glove fitting.
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45 minutes ago, Bolshevik said:

Just some on why VPW demeaned people.  From the self proclaimed guru himself.

 

 

What this guy says is accurate (scientifically) and precise (mathematically).

Imagine having a child with a narcissist and whose most readily weaponized flying monkey is the narcissist VPW. A spiritually dead zombie justifying abuse by invoking the authority of another spiritually dead zombie. Abject Horror.

Some may understand it through the advanced class lens darkly. Charmer spirit, deceiver spirit and python spirit occupying a single dead zombie. Cancer spirit is extra. 

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5 minutes ago, Nathan_Jr said:

. . .

Some may understand it through the advanced class lens darkly. Charmer spirit, deceiver spirit and python spirit occupying a single dead zombie. Cancer spirit is extra. 

 

Leviathan.  Spirit of Leviathan.

https://images.app.goo.gl/JXputei5D3rBX7Fq8

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Nathan_Jr said:

What was the spirit of Leviathan?

According to Wierwille, Leviathan (subject) is (verb) the devil spirit (object) responsible for alcoholism.

"Why?", you ask. Who knows? Maybe it's part of The Great Mystery that people will wrestle with 'til the end of time or at least 'til next Tuesday.

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Just now, waysider said:

According to Wierwille, Leviathan (subject) is (verb) the devil spirit (object) responsible for alcoholism.

"Why?", you ask. Who knows? Maybe it's part of The Great Mystery that people will wrestle with 'til the end of time or at least 'til next Tuesday.

Ha! I see what you did there, Waysider. Whenever I see a preposition or conjunction  in tha werd, I just have to stop and look for a glove into which it will fit.  And if it won't fit logically or spiritually, I'll make it fit. If I can't do it the RIGHT way, I'll do it MY way. Bless your little hearts! I wish you could read it in the self-interpreting original

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On 5/11/2022 at 4:52 PM, WordWolf said:

I'd give that claim a LOT more credence if it had a matching track record.  If there were no Actual Errors for an Actual Errors list, I'd say that was remarkable, to say the least.  pfal- and all of vpw's teachings-  were visibly flawed- visible unless one refuses to consider the possibility they were flawed.  

For most people, that wouldn't really be a problem. 

Anyone teaching can mess up (although this particular field calls for harder work at quality control than some.)   It's only when someone goes around saying God Almighty was personally involved with it, so it has no errors, THAT is when the errors REALLY become an issue.

Agreed

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I've always readily admitted that the Actual Errors list is of no consequence to anyone who wants to use PFAL for its stated purpose. The "thoroughly/throughly" error is actually BETTER as an error than it would have been had he gotten it right [although I suppose he could have retained the value of "read carefully" without the invented distinction between the two words].

"All with/without distinction" is obviously an example of trying to make a concept more clear, and it kind of worked. So what.

But impose an impossible standard, one VPW knew full well could not be met by any work of man [including the Bible, by his own admission he stopped believing it was holy], and suddenly every tiny error becomes monumental... not because of the error, but because of the significance placed on the document's perfection.

 

 

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3 hours ago, JustThinking said:

 

Wait, they still sell Craig's book?!  How do they explain that one?!  

Appareantly so. I thought it was a cobble dtogether, over-wordy mess...and I have a tendancy to be over-wordy...so it's gotta be extra over-wordy for me to pick up on that. 

https://store.theway.org/store/rise-and-expansion/

 

Almost $20 for that one. Appearantly they still consider it irefutable research.

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On 5/15/2022 at 1:20 PM, OldSkool said:

Appareantly so. I thought it was a cobble dtogether, over-wordy mess...and I have a tendancy to be over-wordy...so it's gotta be extra over-wordy for me to pick up on that. 

https://store.theway.org/store/rise-and-expansion/

 

Almost $20 for that one. Appearantly they still consider it irefutable research.

Maybe they just think it’s regurgitatable 

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7 minutes ago, Bolshevik said:

Cha no Twitter: "Heartbreaking and horrific picture of a mother bird feeding  her child, not fish, but plastic garbage! (Source: https://t.co/8qytXrlLaa)  https://t.co/HajTgdLqak" / Twitter

:offtopic: Coincidentally we’ve seen that happening on a high shelf on our back porch – it has become the birthing center for dove…makes us nervous when they start trying their wings – and we have to keep the dogs at bay.

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1120-The-Birth-of-Jesus-Christ-Coloring-

 

This confuses me.   Blue is overused.  Seems an expensive dye back then.  The Pottery Barn look in the back is oddly blue.   Maybe they didn't know about blue back then?

Joseph appears to be pointing out the kid isn't his, for reasons.   

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5 minutes ago, Bolshevik said:

1120-The-Birth-of-Jesus-Christ-Coloring-

 

This confuses me.   Blue is overused.  Seems an expensive dye back then.  The Pottery Barn look in the back is oddly blue.   Maybe they didn't know about blue back then?

Joseph appears to be pointing out the kid isn't his, for reasons.   

Makes me think of Picasso’s blue period…I heard he almost took the class.

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2 minutes ago, T-Bone said:

Makes me think of Picasso’s blue period…I heard he almost took the class.

 

I have a false memory of that too.  His paintings were full of apparent errors according to some . . . the actual errors were seen more clearly when looking at them up close

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1 hour ago, waysider said:

I was thinking the class is better depicted in Hieronymus Bosch's Garden of Earthly Delights.

WIKI LINK

 

Mr. Bosch's work very clearly interprets itself.  

 

220px-Hieronymus_Bosch_030.jpg

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1120-The-Birth-of-Jesus-Christ-Coloring-Good to see that the Mary figure is obeying covid mask safety.

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1 hour ago, waysider said:

I was thinking the class is better depicted in Hieronymus Bosch's Garden of Earthly Delights.

Garden+Of+Earthly+Delights+by+Hieronymus

 

I agree…
…there’s also a rumor Salvador Dali took the class…and it’s been said that one of his most famous paintings was originally titled  The Persistence of Retemories
 

61B3+OrMqWL._AC_SX679_.jpg

Allow me to provide the Greasy Tour Guide interpretation: 


It’s obvious the demise of the Way Tree is due to it being rooted on top of “the teacher’s desk” from the PFAL class. The melting clocks symbolize how much of your time and life disappear unobtrusively during your involvement in The Way International.

Camp Gunnison is featured way in the background and has the appearance of being a mirage – an experiential illusion of you living on a mountain top… vicariously of course, through the cult-leader… or perhaps the mirage is a reference to The Mirage Hotel and Casino in Vegas representing the PFAL promises of glitz and glamour that beckons one to gamble away their soul.

And lastly, the face-melting central to the picture depicts all that is left after the constant exposure to TWI-leadership’s frequent reproofs, hissy fits, diatribes…the melted clock on the melted face also symbolizes how much of your time and life disappear unobtrusively during your involvement in The Way International. It is believed Dali captured the essence of the persistence of retemorizing Bible verses and by extension the obstinate continuance of the TWI-mindset which ultimately render one’s time and life easily accessible for cult abuse in the near future.
 

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Posted (edited)

https://www.artsy.net/article/artsy-editorial-understanding-the-persistence-memory-salvador-dalis-surrealist-masterpiece

(interesting mention surrealism being related to Freud)

"By splattering paint, allowing materials to fall and be placed according to chance, and doodling around the resulting shapes and composition, the artist essentially removed their agency as much as possible from the creative process."

 

Removal of agency . . . like with Manifestations?

 

Edited by Bolshevik
edited without agency . . no idea
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9 minutes ago, Bolshevik said:

https://www.artsy.net/article/artsy-editorial-understanding-the-persistence-memory-salvador-dalis-surrealist-masterpiece

(interesting mention surrealism being related to Freud)

"By splattering paint, allowing materials to fall and be placed according to chance, and doodling around the resulting shapes and composition, the artist essentially removed their agency as much as possible from the creative process."

 

Removal of agency . . . like with Manifestations?

 

Removal of agency – it almost sounds like we’re circling back to Scripture interprets itself…splatter the paint, allow materials to fall and be placed according to chance…paintings paint themselves…that’s the greatest secret in the art world today…what do you think his palette looked like? Doesn’t matter, he wasn’t involved.

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