You are made of solid steel lady...you withstood what would have crushed and destroyed many of the rest of us. Don`t think that I don`t know it...
Many of us just were never in the path of the mog, or not suited to the mogs tastes...or whatever...but many of us who read your posts shudder and think that it very well could have been me.
These guys were sick freaks that found a way to make their perversions seem acceptable. They sucked in a lot of people.
You have shined a light on their lies....set many of us free from feeling that we had to remain loyal to them or their doctrines.
There are not words to express the contempt and disgust I feel for these morally bankrupt, spiritually depraved monsters that did this to you and so many of my sisters.
I can only say how glad I am that you are here now.
The only ones who want to brand you a liar are the ones who cannot accept the truth of who and what wierwille and twi was.
It`s like martindale all over again....they need to make you the one that has something wrong with them so that they don`t have to come to grips with the ominous implications of your testimony.
Thanks for "sharing" excie ... that does seem quite bold of you to speak to lcm like that ... and I suppose most of us can look back and wonder why we stayed so long. But that was our little fairytale world ...
this reminds me of werewolves ... I remember my Mom calling vp "werewolf" ha ...she was right ...
but vp werewolf had the ability to shapeshift ... and some seemed to know of this other side .. .the dark side ... it was like an alternative underworld of intrigue going on behind the Christian ministry front.
And then there were those that got bitten, and those that became werewolf pups ... or maybe it is more like vampires ... once bitten you took on that nature.
Well ... I suppose it is the darker aspects of humanity that led to folklore being written. It takes a fable like story to try to convey the dark "nature of the beast". Maybe I should have paid closer attention to Grimm's Fairy Tales. It probably all fits with a mathmatical exactness.
I suppose this fits in with the sociopath thread ... this thirst for new blood superceded all other agendas at the highest levels of TWI, it would seem (with Ralph an apparent notable exception). It shaped assignments many times, and it is hard not to think that vp on corps night, sipping his drink, was just fumbling through his notes while he "taught" ... his mind was really on those corps women in the front row.
I think of those dogs Ralph mentioned, that Geer called off I think. Or the "bless patrol" that basically held Ralph's family captive ... They were all dogs ... all brothers ... defending the pack and the alpha male. It was all very Grimm indeed.
I'm not sure we got to one of skyrider's initial points
Heck, it seems to me like Ge-er's 'Passing of the Patriarch' paper was an attempt to gloss-over the deeply wounded in twi.......and pin the blame on the then-current trustees. Seems like that whole paper drips with idolatrous attempts to appease 'a godly direction'.........and uphold his idol, wierwille.
I think I said earlier, how could vp not see he was a culprit in leading these men astray. But perhaps he was totally lost in his own ego in werewolf world. His last words were secret ... given to ge-er who knew intimate details of where "the bodies were buried". Maybe VP didn't want his ministry to continue without him as figurehead.
but vp werewolf had the ability to shapeshift ... and some seemed to know of this other side .. .the dark side ... it was like an alternative underworld of intrigue going on behind the Christian ministry front.
I remember at a "weekend in der verd".. maybe it was a trick with the lights, but on stage, the vicster looked like he literallly glowed..
is it possible, he could wear a figurative, or even literal suit of "light" when it was convenient?
Makes me wonder what kind of entity we really were following..
I remember at a "weekend in der verd".. maybe it was a trick with the lights, but on stage, the vicster looked like he literallly glowed..
is it possible, he could wear a figurative, or even literal suit of "light" when it was convenient?
Makes me wonder what kind of entity we really were following..
Ham
Although I can't speak to this particular incident, I can tell you that this effect is rather elementary for a lighting technician.
I was once involved in a production of Royal Hunt Of The Sun which is a play that loosely chronicles the clash between Pizzarro, the explorer, and Atuhalpa, the Inca leader who was considered to be the personification of The Sun God.
When Atuhalpa made his first appearance, he was elevated at center stage and back-lit with a gold gel-paper frame.
He looked for all the world like he was surrounded by an aura. It was extremely effective.(And simple)
Makes me wonder what kind of entity we really were following..
I was thinking the other way around ... those stories of werewolves and monsters were inspired by real men that had ravaged communities. The Jekyll/Hyde nature of some of these "sociopaths" inspired stories of monsters that looked normal or even respectable in the light of day.
There may be a comic book analogy too ... I'm thinking the Joker ... Jack Nicholson dancing around with his minions ... but the joker wasn't very secretive about his nature.
But I'm just saying, this two faced man, good/evil, is a common theme in literature and life. And vp's claim to be MOG with super powers cast him into the mythical genre ... in a sense. So he wanted to be Jesus Christ ... he didn't have the JC initials, but I guess Paul the victor was close enough ... the first Paul failed, so Victor Paul could be the second Paul, instead of the second Adam. :blink:
Maybe most organizations or communities have their own "Secret Agenda Society". There was "the Harper Valley PTA" after all ...
Excie, you don't ever have to apologize for the hell VP put you through - ever.
He knew your past, he didn't care.
I really believe, to him, his sexual lusts and use of many, many women, maybe wasn't even about sex, it was about power. Power to dominate, power over women. He was a misogynist. The way he spoke of women in corps "womens' meetings" was shocking sometimes.
Your sharing both humbles me and fires me up. I am so thankfull that you can share it with us and I sincerely hope you continue to do so. I hope the doubtlessly MANY other women who suffered this vile treatment can take to themselves a little more courage for you having shared.
P.S.
YOU ARE NOT A MEMBER OF THE SECRET AGENDA SOCIETY, YOU ARE A VICTIM OF THOSE HEARTLESS CREAPS.
I totally believe what you're saying. I had some things happen to me, even though I wasn't at HQ. I started crying when I read your posts. PTSD rearing up its ugly head - especially in the spring.
We were all so manipulated and controlled!! I recently finished writing my thesis on ex-cult members transitioning from a cult back into society and I interviewed six ex-cult members. None of them were from TWI and they were from all different groups - only four were from bible-based groups. I've also talked with many ex-cult members. The amazing thing is that these groups always seem to be hung up on sexual issues. And it seems like the women are always used and abused!! It was difficult at times to hear their stories. I'll have to save this for another thread sometime because the focus here is on the secret agenda society.
Thank you for sharing Ex! You are so very brave. I know, personally, how hard it can be to tell one's story because it seems so horrendous.
It all makes sense now why, when the subject of adultery came up in teachings, it was always "spiritual adultery." It was as if only simpletons would think the scriptures were referring to sexual adultery.
I caught the end of a show last night on National Geographic Channel called Inside A Cult. So many similarities - it was creepy. They're showing it again Saturday night, I think.
This thread is unbelievable. The more I learn about TWI, the more it sounds like a David Lynch movie.
...The late Jim Doop told me that the first thing VP wanted from him when he arrived in California was to take him to some orgies and porno places.
Could this be true? Did this Weirwille character have any redeeming qualities?
If they made a movie about TWI, who would play Weirwille? I never met him but I'm thinking Al Pacino (think "The Devil's Advocate") or Dennis Hopper (think "Blue Velvet").
And who would play that Martindale scumbag? Jack Nicholson maybe? (think "The Witches of Eastwick").
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Ham
I think some of those guys who took the bait.. vic STILL owns them, even from the grave..
DontWorryBeHappy
hello fellow greasespotters!............oh yeah, it was "BIG" alright!..................and yet, as big as it was, it was only the most obvious "tip of the iceberg" of the endemic and profound doctrin
DontWorryBeHappy
why should the "leaders" of twi splinters/offshoots be held accountable for their continued adherence to the teachings of vic?............because until they remove the presence of vic from their consc
rascal
That was pretty couragious ex. I don`t believe for an instant that I would have had the courage to speak up or confront the mog.
I would have been destroyed. I would have slunk away like the coward that I was.
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excathedra
he approached me (craig)
he said something like "i hear our girl is coming in this weekend"
i said she's not OUR girl
and i forget the rest
--
i also told dear old martindale after wierwille bit the dust that it was time for him to do the right thing
i guess i could this way because i was by default in the secret society
but not by my choosing
and i'm thinkg now how crazy it all was just like the rest of my life
thanks for listening
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rascal
You are made of solid steel lady...you withstood what would have crushed and destroyed many of the rest of us. Don`t think that I don`t know it...
Many of us just were never in the path of the mog, or not suited to the mogs tastes...or whatever...but many of us who read your posts shudder and think that it very well could have been me.
These guys were sick freaks that found a way to make their perversions seem acceptable. They sucked in a lot of people.
You have shined a light on their lies....set many of us free from feeling that we had to remain loyal to them or their doctrines.
Ex, thankyou for sharing. That took real courage.
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excathedra
a bunch of fecking perverted men who hit the lottery
ppppppfffffttttttttttttt
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rascal
There are not words to express the contempt and disgust I feel for these morally bankrupt, spiritually depraved monsters that did this to you and so many of my sisters.
I can only say how glad I am that you are here now.
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excathedra
ps. whoever might read this, why would i lie, what have i got to lose at this point ?
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
rascal, don't worry about me, my mom loves me
want to chat rascal or anyone else ?
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rascal
The only ones who want to brand you a liar are the ones who cannot accept the truth of who and what wierwille and twi was.
It`s like martindale all over again....they need to make you the one that has something wrong with them so that they don`t have to come to grips with the ominous implications of your testimony.
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wing
I have a friend who quit his hq staff job.
He was devastated; felt that he didn't have another choice.
why?
AOS was gearing up, & some dancers were in from NY at the time, some broadway chorus types. . .
While going to his own car in the auditorium lot, he found a couple in another car doing the 'f...' thing.
The couple was LCM and one of the NY dancers.
They didn't stop when he knocked on the glass.
Before he left he looked me in the eyes and told me all about it.
It's sick.
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excathedra
oh yes the secret dance
no doubt you're telling the truth, wing
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rhino
Thanks for "sharing" excie ... that does seem quite bold of you to speak to lcm like that ... and I suppose most of us can look back and wonder why we stayed so long. But that was our little fairytale world ...
this reminds me of werewolves ... I remember my Mom calling vp "werewolf" ha ...she was right ...
but vp werewolf had the ability to shapeshift ... and some seemed to know of this other side .. .the dark side ... it was like an alternative underworld of intrigue going on behind the Christian ministry front.
And then there were those that got bitten, and those that became werewolf pups ... or maybe it is more like vampires ... once bitten you took on that nature.
Well ... I suppose it is the darker aspects of humanity that led to folklore being written. It takes a fable like story to try to convey the dark "nature of the beast". Maybe I should have paid closer attention to Grimm's Fairy Tales. It probably all fits with a mathmatical exactness.
I suppose this fits in with the sociopath thread ... this thirst for new blood superceded all other agendas at the highest levels of TWI, it would seem (with Ralph an apparent notable exception). It shaped assignments many times, and it is hard not to think that vp on corps night, sipping his drink, was just fumbling through his notes while he "taught" ... his mind was really on those corps women in the front row.
I think of those dogs Ralph mentioned, that Geer called off I think. Or the "bless patrol" that basically held Ralph's family captive ... They were all dogs ... all brothers ... defending the pack and the alpha male. It was all very Grimm indeed.
I'm not sure we got to one of skyrider's initial points
I think I said earlier, how could vp not see he was a culprit in leading these men astray. But perhaps he was totally lost in his own ego in werewolf world. His last words were secret ... given to ge-er who knew intimate details of where "the bodies were buried". Maybe VP didn't want his ministry to continue without him as figurehead.
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Ham
I remember at a "weekend in der verd".. maybe it was a trick with the lights, but on stage, the vicster looked like he literallly glowed..
is it possible, he could wear a figurative, or even literal suit of "light" when it was convenient?
Makes me wonder what kind of entity we really were following..
Edited by HamLink to comment
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waysider
Ham
Although I can't speak to this particular incident, I can tell you that this effect is rather elementary for a lighting technician.
I was once involved in a production of Royal Hunt Of The Sun which is a play that loosely chronicles the clash between Pizzarro, the explorer, and Atuhalpa, the Inca leader who was considered to be the personification of The Sun God.
When Atuhalpa made his first appearance, he was elevated at center stage and back-lit with a gold gel-paper frame.
He looked for all the world like he was surrounded by an aura. It was extremely effective.(And simple)
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rhino
I was thinking the other way around ... those stories of werewolves and monsters were inspired by real men that had ravaged communities. The Jekyll/Hyde nature of some of these "sociopaths" inspired stories of monsters that looked normal or even respectable in the light of day.
There may be a comic book analogy too ... I'm thinking the Joker ... Jack Nicholson dancing around with his minions ... but the joker wasn't very secretive about his nature.
But I'm just saying, this two faced man, good/evil, is a common theme in literature and life. And vp's claim to be MOG with super powers cast him into the mythical genre ... in a sense. So he wanted to be Jesus Christ ... he didn't have the JC initials, but I guess Paul the victor was close enough ... the first Paul failed, so Victor Paul could be the second Paul, instead of the second Adam. :blink:
Maybe most organizations or communities have their own "Secret Agenda Society". There was "the Harper Valley PTA" after all ...
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Sunesis
Excie, you don't ever have to apologize for the hell VP put you through - ever.
He knew your past, he didn't care.
I really believe, to him, his sexual lusts and use of many, many women, maybe wasn't even about sex, it was about power. Power to dominate, power over women. He was a misogynist. The way he spoke of women in corps "womens' meetings" was shocking sometimes.
It was power and domination.
You are remarkably brave to share what happened.
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JeffSjo
Dear Excathedra,
Your sharing both humbles me and fires me up. I am so thankfull that you can share it with us and I sincerely hope you continue to do so. I hope the doubtlessly MANY other women who suffered this vile treatment can take to themselves a little more courage for you having shared.
P.S.
YOU ARE NOT A MEMBER OF THE SECRET AGENDA SOCIETY, YOU ARE A VICTIM OF THOSE HEARTLESS CREAPS.
Please, please don't ever doubt it.
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Estimated Prophet
Thanks for noticing!
For those who didn't notice,
Jesus was there all the time in most of The Sing Along the Way songs!!
" and today He is still sweeter than he was the day before.."
...etc....
Forgive me if I seem too insensitive regarding the bad stuff.
It does strike me that stuff I refused to believe 20 years ago
is stuff I can't deny today.
The Playboy Mansion seems pretty tame compared to some of these stories!
It is all so tragic.
Especially how such abuse was associated with Christian Ministry.
God Bless You Excathedra,
and everyone else.
May the Savior's Love have full course in your hearts and homes
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Lisa
Excathedra,
I totally believe what you're saying. I had some things happen to me, even though I wasn't at HQ. I started crying when I read your posts. PTSD rearing up its ugly head - especially in the spring.
We were all so manipulated and controlled!! I recently finished writing my thesis on ex-cult members transitioning from a cult back into society and I interviewed six ex-cult members. None of them were from TWI and they were from all different groups - only four were from bible-based groups. I've also talked with many ex-cult members. The amazing thing is that these groups always seem to be hung up on sexual issues. And it seems like the women are always used and abused!! It was difficult at times to hear their stories. I'll have to save this for another thread sometime because the focus here is on the secret agenda society.
Thank you for sharing Ex! You are so very brave. I know, personally, how hard it can be to tell one's story because it seems so horrendous.
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outintexas
It all makes sense now why, when the subject of adultery came up in teachings, it was always "spiritual adultery." It was as if only simpletons would think the scriptures were referring to sexual adultery.
I caught the end of a show last night on National Geographic Channel called Inside A Cult. So many similarities - it was creepy. They're showing it again Saturday night, I think.
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excathedra
many thanks for words of encouragement from you all
i'm not sharing for attention
i woke up this morning with my heart in my throat wondering if 12 hours hadn't passed so i could run and delete my posts
and actually, i had time to delete them, and didn't
yea me !!!!!!!
also, i think i meant i have nothing to "gain" by lying not "lose"
but either way
thanks again
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skyrider
BUMP
......to add more background to the current "EXODUS" thread.
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soul searcher
This thread is unbelievable. The more I learn about TWI, the more it sounds like a David Lynch movie.
Could this be true? Did this Weirwille character have any redeeming qualities?
If they made a movie about TWI, who would play Weirwille? I never met him but I'm thinking Al Pacino (think "The Devil's Advocate") or Dennis Hopper (think "Blue Velvet").
And who would play that Martindale scumbag? Jack Nicholson maybe? (think "The Witches of Eastwick").
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waysider
Who would play Wierwille???
I'm thinking Billy Bob Thornton could pull it off with a reprise of his role as Bad Santa.
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Bolshevik
No, Woody Harrelson.
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soul searcher
LOLOLOLOL
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