I just came across a YouTube channel that claims to be L Craig Martindale and he says in it that it’s 2023, and talks about Wierwille and “the truth” about the crucifixion not being on Friday. Are you guys aware he’s resurfaced?
As for "many of us wouldn't even be alive," that's pure vpw propaganda
Yeah, that "I'd be dead..." thing was so common it could have been a part of those cheesy bumper stickers. Well, what about all the people who DID die because of poor decisions made by The Way? (L.EA.D. accident, hitchhiking, suicide, making ill-informed medical decisions, etc.)
A couple off the top of my head. First, gifts or manifestations of the Holy Spirit. We know the stuff is not original but came from B.G. Leonard's ministry, and a wonderful blessing to know, believe and practice. Even some Roman Catholics zealously practice it today. Then there's the birth of Christ and that date in history. I don't know from who VPW learned about the date, anyone know? But I've seen VPW's teaching on this topic in various places through the years and here's another one from recently. A little surprised that Craig didn't teach it during Christmas since it's the type of teaching he'd share during the season....
This and the next 4 installments are the hottest Bible I've heard in many years.
Many gaps in my knowledge were filled in; many old questions answered.
Ditto Mike...so much new light and understanding...loved Proverbs 21:16,17 explanation and the 'blessing in the new wine' of Isaiah 65:8...let alone the 'revelation' of Proverbs 30:18, 19...he still sounds 'grumpy' at times tho lol.
Just go and listen to all 5 teachings and you'll know what I mean.
When you answer "Why should I sit through 3 hours of this?" with "You'll know what I mean once you sit through all 3 hours", you should not be surprised you don't get any nibbles. (That goes for everyone here, but you're famous for that non-answer.)
I just came across a YouTube channel that claims to be L Craig Martindale and he says in it that it’s 2023, and talks about Wierwille and “the truth” about the crucifixion not being on Friday. Are you guys aware he’s resurfaced?
saw it. I’m flabbergasted and disappointed that he thinks he’s relevant and allowed to put “reverend” in hi name.
Ok I tried once again to listen to the incredible forehead.
I got as far into the teaching as him going on about God making a way to escape with the temptation and how you should be getting warnings from God ahead of time to avoid the trap.
LCM was a total puppet; evidence in VP & Me... Others things... I myself benefitted a lot from the way, but also suffered much personal destruction. I DO fantasize about joining the CA Jesus movement which I purposefully decided not to just b/c it seemed too charismatic; would have been MUCH MORE HEALTHY, DOCTRINALLY CORRECT I now believe, AND SAFE. Love John Wimber, Chuck Smith, the Vineyard movement. Oh well...
LCM was a total puppet; evidence in VP & Me... Others things... I myself benefitted a lot from the way, but also suffered much personal destruction. I DO fantasize about joining the CA Jesus movement which I purposefully decided not to just b/c it seemed too charismatic; would have been MUCH MORE HEALTHY, DOCTRINALLY CORRECT I now believe, AND SAFE. Love John Wimber, Chuck Smith, the Vineyard movement. Oh well...
Hi Annio, I've spent some time in the local Vineyard church here and there were some positive things I experienced, but it is definitely a charismatic church. Looking back on that time, one concern I have is their emphasis on inviting the holy spirit to come, especially during the worship service. This belief goes against the doctrine that we have holy spirit permanently dwelling within which is our connection with God and Christ. On the surface, it may not seem like a big difference but many Vineyard people put faith in "experiencing" the holy spirit like "holy laughter" or feeling warmth in their hands as evidence "he" has come to them. In 1994, there was the Toronto Blessing at a Vineyard church which brought thousands of people from around the world to experience the blessing and bring it back to their churches. John Wimber approved of it up to a certain point, until the "manifestations" of making animal sounds became too insane. However, what was happening at the beginning, Wimber believed was of God.
In the church here, their view of the trinity had developed to where Jesus has now become the father and the holy spirit. Before, they were separate but all part of one God in essence. Now, when they read scriptures that are specifically about God the Father, they interpret it as being Jesus. It was so blasphemous that I left the church.
One last thing, the pastor at my church fully believes in the teachings of Mike Bickle of the International House of Prayer Kansas City whose "prophetic history" includes riding in a chariot in heaven and encounters with Jesus and Michael the archangel. They are in a crisis right now due to allegations of sexual misconduct by Bickle so at lot of their false doctrine is being revealed. If the Vineyard you attend accepts Bickle's teachings, especially his book called "Growing in the Prophetic," then it is definitely something you need to research for yourself.
Hi Annio, I've spent some time in the local Vineyard church here and there were some positive things I experienced, but it is definitely a charismatic church. Looking back on that time, one concern I have is their emphasis on inviting the holy spirit to come, especially during the worship service. This belief goes against the doctrine that we have holy spirit permanently dwelling within which is our connection with God and Christ. On the surface, it may not seem like a big difference but many Vineyard people put faith in "experiencing" the holy spirit like "holy laughter" or feeling warmth in their hands as evidence "he" has come to them. In 1994, there was the Toronto Blessing at a Vineyard church which brought thousands of people from around the world to experience the blessing and bring it back to their churches. John Wimber approved of it up to a certain point, until the "manifestations" of making animal sounds became too insane. However, what was happening at the beginning, Wimber believed was of God.
In the church here, their view of the trinity had developed to where Jesus has now become the father and the holy spirit. Before, they were separate but all part of one God in essence. Now, when they read scriptures that are specifically about God the Father, they interpret it as being Jesus. It was so blasphemous that I left the church.
One last thing, the pastor at my church fully believes in the teachings of Mike Bickle of the International House of Prayer Kansas City whose "prophetic history" includes riding in a chariot in heaven and encounters with Jesus and Michael the archangel. They are in a crisis right now due to allegations of sexual misconduct by Bickle so at lot of their false doctrine is being revealed. If the Vineyard you attend accepts Bickle's teachings, especially his book called "Growing in the Prophetic," then it is definitely something you need to research for yourself.
Oh boy! Thank you for all of this Charity! And very interesting how movements evolve... We ALWAYS need to keep a watchful eye on human institutions, eh? I am now involved in an Assembly of God church pastored by a young fellow whose doctrinal positions I am coming alongside more and more. HowEVER, the doctrinal position I MOST appreciate there is that we can have a DIVERSITY OF DOCTRINAL POSITIONS (as well as political, ethnic, etc) re: secondary matters. Yes! Places for robust discussions, but no (ideally) place for narrow-mindedness, group think, conformity, etc. Sorry they are supporting Mike Bickle... Again, thank you for the input!!
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I just came across a YouTube channel that claims to be L Craig Martindale and he says in it that it’s 2023, and talks about Wierwille and “the truth” about the crucifixion not being on Friday. Are you guys aware he’s resurfaced?
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Nathan_Jr
Mmmph
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waysider
Yeah, that "I'd be dead..." thing was so common it could have been a part of those cheesy bumper stickers. Well, what about all the people who DID die because of poor decisions made by The Way? (L.EA.D. accident, hitchhiking, suicide, making ill-informed medical decisions, etc.)
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waysider
Define "hot".
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waysider
Is that a school bus or a motor coach?
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Nathan_Jr
The school bus is merely apparent. When viewed accurately, it's a scientifically precise motor coach.
Accuracy is about MAKING something fit, especially when it doesn't.
I wish you could see it in the original.
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cman
it's hot if you buy into pfal propaganda
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waysider
If I told you a particular movie or book or TV show, or local hot dog stand was good, would I not be expected to elaborate on why I thought so?
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waysider
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Mike
Well, I did say this:
"Many gaps in my knowledge were filled in; many old questions answered."
Joseph and Jacob were always mysterious stories to me, and now they are not. I get it.
I just was not in the mood to debate what was hot and what was not. It's pretty subjective.
But the teachings were extremely informative, and I could relate to the characters as real humans, and fellow believers.
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waysider
Can you give an example?
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oldiesman
A couple off the top of my head. First, gifts or manifestations of the Holy Spirit. We know the stuff is not original but came from B.G. Leonard's ministry, and a wonderful blessing to know, believe and practice. Even some Roman Catholics zealously practice it today. Then there's the birth of Christ and that date in history. I don't know from who VPW learned about the date, anyone know? But I've seen VPW's teaching on this topic in various places through the years and here's another one from recently. A little surprised that Craig didn't teach it during Christmas since it's the type of teaching he'd share during the season....
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waysider
I was asking for "extremely informative" examples from the Martindale teachings.
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Allan
Ditto Mike...so much new light and understanding...loved Proverbs 21:16,17 explanation and the 'blessing in the new wine' of Isaiah 65:8...let alone the 'revelation' of Proverbs 30:18, 19...he still sounds 'grumpy' at times tho lol.
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Rocky
By definition of subjectivity, that is inherently not a true statement.
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WordWolf
When you answer "Why should I sit through 3 hours of this?" with "You'll know what I mean once you sit through all 3 hours", you should not be surprised you don't get any nibbles. (That goes for everyone here, but you're famous for that non-answer.)
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bliss
saw it. I’m flabbergasted and disappointed that he thinks he’s relevant and allowed to put “reverend” in hi name.
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annio
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annio
LCM was a total puppet; evidence in VP & Me... Others things... I myself benefitted a lot from the way, but also suffered much personal destruction. I DO fantasize about joining the CA Jesus movement which I purposefully decided not to just b/c it seemed too charismatic; would have been MUCH MORE HEALTHY, DOCTRINALLY CORRECT I now believe, AND SAFE. Love John Wimber, Chuck Smith, the Vineyard movement. Oh well...
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Charity
Hi Annio, I've spent some time in the local Vineyard church here and there were some positive things I experienced, but it is definitely a charismatic church. Looking back on that time, one concern I have is their emphasis on inviting the holy spirit to come, especially during the worship service. This belief goes against the doctrine that we have holy spirit permanently dwelling within which is our connection with God and Christ. On the surface, it may not seem like a big difference but many Vineyard people put faith in "experiencing" the holy spirit like "holy laughter" or feeling warmth in their hands as evidence "he" has come to them. In 1994, there was the Toronto Blessing at a Vineyard church which brought thousands of people from around the world to experience the blessing and bring it back to their churches. John Wimber approved of it up to a certain point, until the "manifestations" of making animal sounds became too insane. However, what was happening at the beginning, Wimber believed was of God.
In the church here, their view of the trinity had developed to where Jesus has now become the father and the holy spirit. Before, they were separate but all part of one God in essence. Now, when they read scriptures that are specifically about God the Father, they interpret it as being Jesus. It was so blasphemous that I left the church.
One last thing, the pastor at my church fully believes in the teachings of Mike Bickle of the International House of Prayer Kansas City whose "prophetic history" includes riding in a chariot in heaven and encounters with Jesus and Michael the archangel. They are in a crisis right now due to allegations of sexual misconduct by Bickle so at lot of their false doctrine is being revealed. If the Vineyard you attend accepts Bickle's teachings, especially his book called "Growing in the Prophetic," then it is definitely something you need to research for yourself.
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annio
Oh boy! Thank you for all of this Charity! And very interesting how movements evolve... We ALWAYS need to keep a watchful eye on human institutions, eh? I am now involved in an Assembly of God church pastored by a young fellow whose doctrinal positions I am coming alongside more and more. HowEVER, the doctrinal position I MOST appreciate there is that we can have a DIVERSITY OF DOCTRINAL POSITIONS (as well as political, ethnic, etc) re: secondary matters. Yes! Places for robust discussions, but no (ideally) place for narrow-mindedness, group think, conformity, etc. Sorry they are supporting Mike Bickle... Again, thank you for the input!!
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Mike
In the past few weeks I have listened carefully to LCM's 5 most recent teachings, all on Joseph of Egypt.
Part 1 is here: https://archive.org/details/harvest-pt-8-the-remnant-of-joseph-254-12-23-23
This and the next 4 installments are the hottest Bible I've heard in many years.
Many gaps in my knowledge were filled in; many old questions answered.
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Mike
Why define it?
Just go and listen to all 5 teachings and you'll know what I mean.
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