I'm sure they already got tons of tuition money out of them by that point too.
In all fairness to TWI at what other school could you get tuition, books, room and board for $300 a month in the 80s? Don't think they were making oodles of money from tuition. Granted we had to work 4 hours a day, but still $300 was dirt cheap. In 1971 I attended a class at a private college to the tune of $40 per credit. This did not include books, room, or board.
OK, maybe they didn't get TONS of money out of them. I have no idea how tuition for WC cost. I know I sent a check evey month to my spiritual partner, in addition to my ABS money that supposedly helped pay for the program.
The rooms in Founder's Hall are pretty tiny. Oh yeah, and ABS money paid for that building too.
My main point is that so many applicants were sent home after relatively short periods of time. Why?
And what books did they provide students? I'm sure they were all required to bring their collaterals and other study tools.
At least after the end of four years at a college you'd have a degree you could use to get a job.
...And let's not forget that twi was training people in the corps to eventually become a FREE WORKFORCE.
There was a lot of pressure put on corps grads to recruit others into the corps...even as there was pressure put on twiers to recruit people to take the class and to go WOW. The requirments? Usually, if you had completed the advanced class, had gone out WOW and could read without moving your lips, you were considerd "corps material".
Why were so many sent home? When a person was booted from the corps, they left but their money stayed...kapeesh?
I remember our area leader telling us, during a meeting, to write down one person we thought should go into the Corps and commit ourselves to making it happen.
I didn't get it, because natural leadership ability was the primary characteristic needed. People with natural leadership ability don't need to be pushed into things, i.e. the Corps.
They would take it upon themselves to apply to the Corps. If a person had to be pushed into it, they shouldn't be Corps.
They were defeating their own purpose by recruiting.
Your comment about tuition would apply if twi was just an educational facility, who's very infrastructure was in place simply to provide instruction and learning to its students. However, 99% of twi's structure would (and still is) in place whether the corps was there or not...
And the items that were specific to the corps training, dorms, food, cleaning, training staff... were clearly either paid for by ABS, or were very much offset by the workforce the corps represented.
Example... you needed staff to oversee the corps who did groundskeeping. BUT... the corps trimmed the trees, planted the flowers, mowed the grass, cleaned the woods of groundfall, and chopped wood that the leaders used in their fireplaces. Quite an offset, there. Five minimally paid staff --- thirty free laborers.
Even in the dorms, which were obviously built for the purpose of housing corps... they were cleaned, decorated, painted, and wall-papered by free way corps labor. Tell me what university doesn't have to pay for those services, which is then charged back to the community and the students...
I went into the corps within a year of getting in TWI. I had to take ALL the classes TWI had at the time, including the Advanced class and get my sponsors together.
While in the Corps all of us were split in 2 groups. Part of us worked in the a.m. and part of us worked in the p.m. The other 4 hours we were in "study hall". I don't know exactly what we were supposed to be studying because we didn't have "classes". We had Tuesday night teachings that VP gave - which meant we listened to him talk the whole time.
TWI made out like a bandit. They got free labor from us and our sponsors paid TWI $300 a month for us to do that labor. Our sponsors paid TWI to let us do all their work. What a con job!!!! I'd call that a con and thievery. On the word, or what????
They always wanted me to do work on grounds, in kitchen etc instead of spend time with my child. I used to buck them all the time on that. I spent time with my child as much as possible but got in trouble all the time for doing it. I'm glad I did what was right instead of giving in to their dictations. They were child illiterate!!!!!
My husband at the time had been working staff for a year before I graduated and making about $400 a month. When I graduated I started working full time staff also and never received a paycheck. When I asked them why and gave them the scripture that a laborer was worthy of.... they said they paid couples according to needs!!!!
When I told them I wanted a paycheck too and if I didn't get it I was quitting they told me I was a troublmaker and had a bad attitude. I said, whatever - pay me or I'm quitting so they asked us to leave headquarters. Boy, that was a hard decision!! We left and went to the state of our choice and I got out of the ministry. Well, that's how I got in and got out!!!
you had to really love god enough to serve him in a very special way. i don't know how to explain that. but it was like a big commitment and calling. i had almost become a nun and i had almost joined the peace corps. i was thinking this was the real deal of what i was always meant to do.....
you had to get the monthly sponsorship together (sweet wonderful believers, i had too many to count)
there was a "what to bring" list which was hard to get together since i was quite young
All but $100.00 was paid by my sponcers to be in the WC. My whole experiance financially in TWI has always been substandard. For me I tried for so many years to reap the "more abundent life" and always came up short... always in a state of poverty. Sadly at that time I believed it was me and my unbelief.
In the WC I learnrd to travel light, not own a damn thing and live by second hand stores. Buying something new was out of the question.
Leadership ability was the criteria for entering the WC. Surprisingly though while in the 15th corps it apeared to me that anyone with a strong sence of self and leadership ability was emotionally and mentally torn apart. It was like any sucess prior to the WC was invalid and you were considered stupid. You were treated disrespectfully. So requirement for being in the WC was a contrdiction for the way you were treated.
I did my apprenticeship year in 95 and then they changed the program to 5yr.....I figured the timing was not good, plus the NEW definition of a disciple had me wondering if I could leap that high..so I backed out!!!!!!
I did my apprenticeship year in 95 and then they changed the program to 5yr.....I figured the timing was not good, plus the NEW definition of a disciple had me wondering if I could leap that high..so I backed out!!!!!!
wheeeww
I thought that they kept it at 4 years, but changed it to:
Candidate Year: Just like the old "apprentice year"
Apprentice Year: Required to be a Way Disciple, and then work on staff
It was still like that when I left in 2004, The Highway.
Ang3la C@p1llary was my HFC and she lived with the Moneyhands for years. She wanted to go into the WC training program, but she has some problems with her feet and doesn't walk "normally". Now, she does walk and she gets around great - she is also sharp as a tack, extremely intelligent and has a delightful personality. We got along great till she started getting all legalistic and blaming my ex and I for things that were her fault, but that's a story for another day.....
Anyway, this young lady who would be a dream candidate for any corporation had one heck of a time getting accepted into the WC. They allowed her to go WD and she was obviously a pet of Moneyhands, but because of her "handicap" Rico, Bolchok and others at HQ did not want her in the WC. She had to campaign and visit Gunnison a few times for them to "observe" her and even then, they dragged their feet.
Moneyhands was so p1ssed about it, but too d@mn wussy to say anything. Even when they didn't give her a decision by the date they promised to, he didn't raise holy hell. So much for saying what you mean and meaning what you say, eh, Rico? ;)
You'd think that with low numbers in the WC they'd be falling all over themselves to let her into the program. You'd also think that they would be concerned about "discrimination" lawsuits, too. In fact, perhaps that's why they eventually did let her into the program. :unsure:
She's got so much going for her, pity it's being wasted in TWI. :(
In all fairness to TWI at what other school could you get tuition, books, room and board for $300 a month in the 80s? Don't think they were making oodles of money from tuition. Granted we had to work 4 hours a day, but still $300 was dirt cheap. In 1971 I attended a class at a private college to the tune of $40 per credit. This did not include books, room, or board.
I am guessing one of the major differences between wc and attending a private college is accreditation :blink:
If we get honest... did the wc do anything that would help to get a better career or better paying job? (with the possible exception of what ever "job" experience you were getting).
And in all fairness... Some people learned job skills and were able to start there own business.
I am guessing one of the major differences between wc and attending a private college is accreditation :blink:
Then again, if you go to a private college, you have to look hard to make sure
1 If the school is accredited
2 If it's an accreditation that's accepted by others (including other colleges)
The 2nd is important. A lot of private colleges have accreditation that's not accepted if you try to transfer the credits. I know of one private college here that offer education degree (all the way up to PHd's). The credits not only aren't transferrable to other schools, but once you graduate, nobody (including this particular school) will accept the degree for a position!!!
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Lifted Up
The candidate was supposed to have natural leadership ability. Othwise, as you say, the money thing.
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GeorgeStGeorge
Local leadership kept pushing me to apply. I have no idea why!! :lol:
George
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Nato
It seemed to me that they were pushing any warm-blooded advanced class grad to apply.
It also seemed to me that those who went, always came back home after about 6 months to a year.
And then they were pushed to RE-apply.
I'm sure they already got tons of tuition money out of them by that point too.
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Stayed Too Long
In all fairness to TWI at what other school could you get tuition, books, room and board for $300 a month in the 80s? Don't think they were making oodles of money from tuition. Granted we had to work 4 hours a day, but still $300 was dirt cheap. In 1971 I attended a class at a private college to the tune of $40 per credit. This did not include books, room, or board.
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Nato
OK, maybe they didn't get TONS of money out of them. I have no idea how tuition for WC cost. I know I sent a check evey month to my spiritual partner, in addition to my ABS money that supposedly helped pay for the program.
The rooms in Founder's Hall are pretty tiny. Oh yeah, and ABS money paid for that building too.
My main point is that so many applicants were sent home after relatively short periods of time. Why?
And what books did they provide students? I'm sure they were all required to bring their collaterals and other study tools.
At least after the end of four years at a college you'd have a degree you could use to get a job.
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WordWolf
Accomodations for corps were equivalent to TINY dorms.
You PAID to be in the corps.
You performed manual labour in the corps.
Food was, apparently, nutritious, but the menu was sparse.
Nutritious, but uninspiring food.
Nothing you would CHOOSE to eat if you had options.
Very few books were actually issued to the corps.
So, room and board were bottom-of-the-line,
and economies of scale made them cheaper.
I believe that if ALL they got was the $300,
they DID turn a profit.
Plus, there were "spiritual partners" and other sources
of income. The corps didn't need to turn a profit.
Of course, when it was organized to have LOTS of
members, it was organized to do exactly that,
and sacrificed QUALITY for QUANTITY.
Real training, or minimal training and a profit?
I would have trained FEW but with the top training
that could be done.
They preferred to up the numbers as much as
possible, and ANY teacher could tell you that
the larger the class size, the less attention
each student gets-so MORE students means
LESSER teaching.
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GrouchoMarxJr
...And let's not forget that twi was training people in the corps to eventually become a FREE WORKFORCE.
There was a lot of pressure put on corps grads to recruit others into the corps...even as there was pressure put on twiers to recruit people to take the class and to go WOW. The requirments? Usually, if you had completed the advanced class, had gone out WOW and could read without moving your lips, you were considerd "corps material".
Why were so many sent home? When a person was booted from the corps, they left but their money stayed...kapeesh?
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outandabout
I remember our area leader telling us, during a meeting, to write down one person we thought should go into the Corps and commit ourselves to making it happen.
I didn't get it, because natural leadership ability was the primary characteristic needed. People with natural leadership ability don't need to be pushed into things, i.e. the Corps.
They would take it upon themselves to apply to the Corps. If a person had to be pushed into it, they shouldn't be Corps.
They were defeating their own purpose by recruiting.
There were enough chiefs for the Indians already.
Didn't get that approach. Still don't.
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TheHighWay
Stayed Too Long...
Your comment about tuition would apply if twi was just an educational facility, who's very infrastructure was in place simply to provide instruction and learning to its students. However, 99% of twi's structure would (and still is) in place whether the corps was there or not...
And the items that were specific to the corps training, dorms, food, cleaning, training staff... were clearly either paid for by ABS, or were very much offset by the workforce the corps represented.
Example... you needed staff to oversee the corps who did groundskeeping. BUT... the corps trimmed the trees, planted the flowers, mowed the grass, cleaned the woods of groundfall, and chopped wood that the leaders used in their fireplaces. Quite an offset, there. Five minimally paid staff --- thirty free laborers.
Even in the dorms, which were obviously built for the purpose of housing corps... they were cleaned, decorated, painted, and wall-papered by free way corps labor. Tell me what university doesn't have to pay for those services, which is then charged back to the community and the students...
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Edi
I went into the corps within a year of getting in TWI. I had to take ALL the classes TWI had at the time, including the Advanced class and get my sponsors together.
While in the Corps all of us were split in 2 groups. Part of us worked in the a.m. and part of us worked in the p.m. The other 4 hours we were in "study hall". I don't know exactly what we were supposed to be studying because we didn't have "classes". We had Tuesday night teachings that VP gave - which meant we listened to him talk the whole time.
TWI made out like a bandit. They got free labor from us and our sponsors paid TWI $300 a month for us to do that labor. Our sponsors paid TWI to let us do all their work. What a con job!!!! I'd call that a con and thievery. On the word, or what????
They always wanted me to do work on grounds, in kitchen etc instead of spend time with my child. I used to buck them all the time on that. I spent time with my child as much as possible but got in trouble all the time for doing it. I'm glad I did what was right instead of giving in to their dictations. They were child illiterate!!!!!
My husband at the time had been working staff for a year before I graduated and making about $400 a month. When I graduated I started working full time staff also and never received a paycheck. When I asked them why and gave them the scripture that a laborer was worthy of.... they said they paid couples according to needs!!!!
When I told them I wanted a paycheck too and if I didn't get it I was quitting they told me I was a troublmaker and had a bad attitude. I said, whatever - pay me or I'm quitting so they asked us to leave headquarters. Boy, that was a hard decision!! We left and went to the state of our choice and I got out of the ministry. Well, that's how I got in and got out!!!
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excathedra
you had to really love god enough to serve him in a very special way. i don't know how to explain that. but it was like a big commitment and calling. i had almost become a nun and i had almost joined the peace corps. i was thinking this was the real deal of what i was always meant to do.....
you had to get the monthly sponsorship together (sweet wonderful believers, i had too many to count)
there was a "what to bring" list which was hard to get together since i was quite young
you also had to complete all the classes
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excathedra
time line wise
i was accepted for the 8th but waited for the 9th. i think the year was 1978 but i'm not sure
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lilbit
All but $100.00 was paid by my sponcers to be in the WC. My whole experiance financially in TWI has always been substandard. For me I tried for so many years to reap the "more abundent life" and always came up short... always in a state of poverty. Sadly at that time I believed it was me and my unbelief.
In the WC I learnrd to travel light, not own a damn thing and live by second hand stores. Buying something new was out of the question.
Leadership ability was the criteria for entering the WC. Surprisingly though while in the 15th corps it apeared to me that anyone with a strong sence of self and leadership ability was emotionally and mentally torn apart. It was like any sucess prior to the WC was invalid and you were considered stupid. You were treated disrespectfully. So requirement for being in the WC was a contrdiction for the way you were treated.
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likeaneagle
I did my apprenticeship year in 95 and then they changed the program to 5yr.....I figured the timing was not good, plus the NEW definition of a disciple had me wondering if I could leap that high..so I backed out!!!!!!
wheeeww
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Oakspear
Candidate Year: Just like the old "apprentice year"
Apprentice Year: Required to be a Way Disciple, and then work on staff
Two Years "In Residence"
:unsure:
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TheHighWay
Wow, Oaks... THAT's the structure for going way corps?
I was still in, in 1995, but somehow I ignored that little tidbit of info... YUCK.
Is it still like that?
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Belle
It was still like that when I left in 2004, The Highway.
Ang3la C@p1llary was my HFC and she lived with the Moneyhands for years. She wanted to go into the WC training program, but she has some problems with her feet and doesn't walk "normally". Now, she does walk and she gets around great - she is also sharp as a tack, extremely intelligent and has a delightful personality. We got along great till she started getting all legalistic and blaming my ex and I for things that were her fault, but that's a story for another day.....
Anyway, this young lady who would be a dream candidate for any corporation had one heck of a time getting accepted into the WC. They allowed her to go WD and she was obviously a pet of Moneyhands, but because of her "handicap" Rico, Bolchok and others at HQ did not want her in the WC. She had to campaign and visit Gunnison a few times for them to "observe" her and even then, they dragged their feet.
Moneyhands was so p1ssed about it, but too d@mn wussy to say anything. Even when they didn't give her a decision by the date they promised to, he didn't raise holy hell. So much for saying what you mean and meaning what you say, eh, Rico? ;)
You'd think that with low numbers in the WC they'd be falling all over themselves to let her into the program. You'd also think that they would be concerned about "discrimination" lawsuits, too. In fact, perhaps that's why they eventually did let her into the program. :unsure:
She's got so much going for her, pity it's being wasted in TWI. :(
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Zshot
I am guessing one of the major differences between wc and attending a private college is accreditation :blink:
If we get honest... did the wc do anything that would help to get a better career or better paying job? (with the possible exception of what ever "job" experience you were getting).
And in all fairness... Some people learned job skills and were able to start there own business.
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moony3424
Then again, if you go to a private college, you have to look hard to make sure
1 If the school is accredited
2 If it's an accreditation that's accepted by others (including other colleges)
The 2nd is important. A lot of private colleges have accreditation that's not accepted if you try to transfer the credits. I know of one private college here that offer education degree (all the way up to PHd's). The credits not only aren't transferrable to other schools, but once you graduate, nobody (including this particular school) will accept the degree for a position!!!
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Oakspear
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