They told me some members of my family were welcome and some were not so I told them that was not acceptable and then they said none of us were welcome. I had second thoughts a bit but after being out for 6 months and realizing that God still spit in my direction just like He always had, I figured everything must be OK. Haven't looked back since.
The kicker for me was after pop, and a host of other things. Leadership were given the choice of "who do you stand with?" Then shortly after, Loy sent out his 10:30 fellowship tape that was so filled with pride and ego that after I heard it I was physically ill. I realized that no changes will be made and IMHO Lxx had gone to the dark side. There was so many things before that, that made me want to leave, but I kept holding out for a possible change. I never liked Lxx and always wondered why he was chosen, but I just kept on hoping that it would turn out great. It seemed like we were being more controlled, and our freedoms were being ripped from us.
When I went to a church to see "what else was out there" and saw more love for God, for each other, more practical Biblical teaching than I had heard in a long time, and more enthusiasm for life------I knew it was time to go somehow. We had begun to see that things were dead and lifeless in twi, but for me, going to that church sealed it. It was just a matter of time after that.
I was dying from the inside out. I had realized that there was no genuine, true or real love or power of God left in twi. Twi had become a legalistic, controlling, prying, invasive "cult of personality."
It was a hard and long struggle for me to make the break, I had to move to a different state to leave behind my dearly loved friends, but once I finally made the decision, I felt IMMEDIATELY as if a ton of bricks had been lifted off of my heart.
I left just over five years ago, after spending 28 years "in." Since then, the road has been a long and strange trip, but over the past year, I have FINALLY found the life I knew was out there all along.
I hope some innies read these threads, and make the leap to freedom.
1) The screaming confrontations. That is a big turnoff and IMHO, we are adults, you don't need to yell at me to get your point across.
2) When the Twig Coordinator (a Way Corpse) says to me: "When we tell you to jump, you don't ask why, you ask how high."
3) Getting into my personal space. So my room is not in order because of books and schoolpapers around as I was a college student then and I needed to study. For that, do I need to get reproof by every-frigging-one.
4) Always telling me to make time for the Word everyday , jeez, easy for them to say when they don't have to go to school full-time, work, make time for schoolwork plus have to make time for transportation, food and sleep. It just got too much stress and no free time for anything. They want us to be robots.
5) When same Way Corpse Twig tells me that I must tithe from any money that I get (work, help from parents and school financial aid).
That's it. They just place too much hoops and obstacles so that you can receive the "Love" of God. It's like they regulate who receives God's blessing and protection. All their yadda yadda about "Salvation is by Grace, not by Works". To them, it's actually backwards:"Salvation is by Works, not by Grace".
@*#( that and @*#( the Way International and @*#( the Way Corpse especially that S** Bl**m*re.
Well I went out because I get really angry and frustrated: For some years I have had big different point of views with my Country Coordinator. I want to do the things more like LCM said, to confront, but he did not what to do so because he does not speak English and does not studied the tapes just the Spanish tapes (one per month) and he want to support the slothful .
After we finished to run a The Way Class one of the believers of the household fellowship that I coordinate did a very stupid thing so I confront her and she did not like the confrontation so the Country Coordinator confront me but I was right. So I got mad and get out.
Eyes opened after seeing sexual misconduct at Indiana campus being 'brushed over'.
ROA in the family corps tent and a very over-zealous 'newly graduated' corps brother ripping into my 5 year old son for eating a cookie half in, half out of our tent.
Personally, I think the guy was pi*#ed off because he had been assigned to Alaska..but in hindsight I could really thank him now !!
Little did we know Chris Geer... ah well, live and learn.
The great thing about ditching with Geer, for me (and I presume I can's speak for WordWolf on this) is that leaving when and how we did showed us how to not be a respector of titles and positions. Made it easier to disregard Geer when the time came.
After pop, I decided to go to the seminar about "what really happened" and heard the teachings on mark and avoid. I confronted the leader on how off the Word that was. That seminar proved to me that the Way I had known and loved was no longer is existence, and I had no desire to be a part of what had taken it's place.
There was a point there when the "WOW" burgers went way downhill - think it was the early 80's...help me out here. :unsure: Actually the beef was fine, but they changed the buns. I think Purchasing was trying to save a few nickels.
Little did we know Chris Geer... ah well, live and learn.
The great thing about ditching with Geer, for me (and I presume I can's speak for WordWolf on this) is that leaving when and how we did showed us how to not be a respector of titles and positions. Made it easier to disregard Geer when the time came.
For me.....already had two or three run-ins with cgeer years earlier. He flat out lied about some things and distorted the context of these situations. Others knew.....but didn't want to get near the flames.
So, I opted to stay with twi...........little did I know, at the time, that BOTH CHOICES were bad.
Yep, the school of hard knocks.....I graduated with honors.
The local fellowship made it very clear that I was unwelcome because of my spouses refusal to be *good* corpes.
I kept going anyway, enduring the rudeness hoping that they would find some value in me.....untill they moved the fellowship and wouldn`t tell me where...shrug.
I never left in my mind even after reading trans chat and waydale for over a year.....untill greasespot and began reading excathedras posts when she started revealing wierwilles sexual assault :(
Up untill that point I think I would have still tried to attend and be a good believer if I had been able to find a fellowship.
That was when it came thundering home that twi was not the Godly group that I had supported....and that a man would have to be very evil ...evil to the core to do what he had done.
Why I was able to dismiss the stories of sexual impropriety before this?....Why I was able to ignore the evidence of evil prior to this ? I have no idea....I can only say that THIS was the breaking point for me in my mind....I was then able to begin my evaluation of teachings ...ideas and perception aquired over a decade of association with twi. It was my first taste of actually freedom....of allowing myself to think outside of the tight little box that had been imprisoned in.....even though I had been away from twi for almost 5 years.
We stayed after POP, but then we didn't really know what was going on. We didn't read POP until 2000, when we found it online. Uur Way leader then was a good guy, the corps in the area that left were clickish and never had much to say to us, so we stayed with the group that seemed healthiest to us.
We left in the late nineties when our HFC got more and more into our business. Our previous LC had been a buddy of ours from the old days(early eighties) and our HFC was held back by that. Then we got a new limb guy, who gave our HFC his way.
Leaving or letting this creepy guy run us into the ground were our only options. We left.
Mine was complex, yet simple: in two separate instances, actions or words purported to be revelation by a MOG or WOG resulted in horrible pain and loss. I thought it was my unbelieving that caused their revelation to be wrong, so I left.
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johniam
They told me some members of my family were welcome and some were not so I told them that was not acceptable and then they said none of us were welcome. I had second thoughts a bit but after being out for 6 months and realizing that God still spit in my direction just like He always had, I figured everything must be OK. Haven't looked back since.
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gladtobeout
The kicker for me was after pop, and a host of other things. Leadership were given the choice of "who do you stand with?" Then shortly after, Loy sent out his 10:30 fellowship tape that was so filled with pride and ego that after I heard it I was physically ill. I realized that no changes will be made and IMHO Lxx had gone to the dark side. There was so many things before that, that made me want to leave, but I kept holding out for a possible change. I never liked Lxx and always wondered why he was chosen, but I just kept on hoping that it would turn out great. It seemed like we were being more controlled, and our freedoms were being ripped from us.
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GeorgeStGeorge
Got booted for thinking. Probably wouldn't have been around too much longer, though.
George
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penguin
When I went to a church to see "what else was out there" and saw more love for God, for each other, more practical Biblical teaching than I had heard in a long time, and more enthusiasm for life------I knew it was time to go somehow. We had begun to see that things were dead and lifeless in twi, but for me, going to that church sealed it. It was just a matter of time after that.
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skyrider
The lcm-driven arrogance of twi had reached a new zenith.......after the wap class release.
And, the "promised land" terminology fueled this elitist attitude.
Calculated confrontation was the order of the day.
Enough was enough.
Many nearby churches were offering a whole lot more.
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Radar OReilly
I was dying from the inside out. I had realized that there was no genuine, true or real love or power of God left in twi. Twi had become a legalistic, controlling, prying, invasive "cult of personality."
It was a hard and long struggle for me to make the break, I had to move to a different state to leave behind my dearly loved friends, but once I finally made the decision, I felt IMMEDIATELY as if a ton of bricks had been lifted off of my heart.
I left just over five years ago, after spending 28 years "in." Since then, the road has been a long and strange trip, but over the past year, I have FINALLY found the life I knew was out there all along.
I hope some innies read these threads, and make the leap to freedom.
Radar
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FreeFromCults
What made me leave after being there for 3 years?
1) The screaming confrontations. That is a big turnoff and IMHO, we are adults, you don't need to yell at me to get your point across.
2) When the Twig Coordinator (a Way Corpse) says to me: "When we tell you to jump, you don't ask why, you ask how high."
3) Getting into my personal space. So my room is not in order because of books and schoolpapers around as I was a college student then and I needed to study. For that, do I need to get reproof by every-frigging-one.
4) Always telling me to make time for the Word everyday
, jeez, easy for them to say when they don't have to go to school full-time, work, make time for schoolwork plus have to make time for transportation, food and sleep. It just got too much stress and no free time for anything. They want us to be robots.
5) When same Way Corpse Twig tells me that I must tithe from any money that I get (work, help from parents and school financial aid).
That's it. They just place too much hoops and obstacles so that you can receive the "Love"
of God. It's like they regulate who receives God's blessing and protection. All their yadda yadda about "Salvation is by Grace, not by Works". To them, it's actually backwards:"Salvation is by Works, not by Grace".
@*#( that and @*#( the Way International and @*#( the Way Corpse especially that S** Bl**m*re.
F*cking hypocrites.
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justloafing
How True
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outintexas
Just slip out the back, jack
Make a new plan, stan
You don’t need to be coy, roy
Just get yourself free
Hop on the bus, gus
You don’t need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, lee
And get yourself free
Paul Simon was right!
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frank123lol
How do you follow up on that?They,twi just got too nosey,So I toldem it is not any of your buisness,Then
husband and wife did a conference call on me,well,to say the least I was pi@@ed and hung up on them.
I like Bill joel "Its my life ,leave me alone".
Oh they had gotten me to sell my house,and I was renting and miserable!Even the landlord said we were
stupid for renting!Well that problem was changed real quick!
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Raf
ROA 1989. Major turnoff: inaccurate teachings, condescension from all levels, and LCM as our "spiritual head." BARF.
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themex
Well I went out because I get really angry and frustrated: For some years I have had big different point of views with my Country Coordinator. I want to do the things more like LCM said, to confront, but he did not what to do so because he does not speak English and does not studied the tapes just the Spanish tapes (one per month) and he want to support the slothful .
After we finished to run a The Way Class one of the believers of the household fellowship that I coordinate did a very stupid thing so I confront her and she did not like the confrontation so the Country Coordinator confront me but I was right. So I got mad and get out.
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allan w.
Eyes opened after seeing sexual misconduct at Indiana campus being 'brushed over'.
ROA in the family corps tent and a very over-zealous 'newly graduated' corps brother ripping into my 5 year old son for eating a cookie half in, half out of our tent.
Personally, I think the guy was pi*#ed off because he had been assigned to Alaska..but in hindsight I could really thank him now !!
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WordWolf
Not to mention this followed lcm making a DEMAND for an oath of loyalty,
and saying that you refused to choose among men instead was not an
option. This was a BLATANT disregard for Acts and how the average
Christian was to be treated.
(We had no idea this was how vpw and lcm had always run the corps,
and this was now just getting around to the rest of us.)
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Raf
Little did we know Chris Geer... ah well, live and learn.
The great thing about ditching with Geer, for me (and I presume I can's speak for WordWolf on this) is that leaving when and how we did showed us how to not be a respector of titles and positions. Made it easier to disregard Geer when the time came.
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Suda
After pop, I decided to go to the seminar about "what really happened" and heard the teachings on mark and avoid. I confronted the leader on how off the Word that was. That seminar proved to me that the Way I had known and loved was no longer is existence, and I had no desire to be a part of what had taken it's place.
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dmiller
The POP was the turning point for me too, SS.
When that hit the fan, I realized all was not a *bed of roses*.
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socks
There was a point there when the "WOW" burgers went way downhill - think it was the early 80's...help me out here. :unsure: Actually the beef was fine, but they changed the buns. I think Purchasing was trying to save a few nickels.
Bad buns. :blink: :( Scarey.
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skyrider
For me.....already had two or three run-ins with cgeer years earlier. He flat out lied about some things and distorted the context of these situations. Others knew.....but didn't want to get near the flames.
So, I opted to stay with twi...........little did I know, at the time, that BOTH CHOICES were bad.
Yep, the school of hard knocks.....I graduated with honors.
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rascal
The local fellowship made it very clear that I was unwelcome because of my spouses refusal to be *good* corpes.
I kept going anyway, enduring the rudeness hoping that they would find some value in me.....untill they moved the fellowship and wouldn`t tell me where...shrug.
I never left in my mind even after reading trans chat and waydale for over a year.....untill greasespot and began reading excathedras posts when she started revealing wierwilles sexual assault :(
Up untill that point I think I would have still tried to attend and be a good believer if I had been able to find a fellowship.
That was when it came thundering home that twi was not the Godly group that I had supported....and that a man would have to be very evil ...evil to the core to do what he had done.
Why I was able to dismiss the stories of sexual impropriety before this?....Why I was able to ignore the evidence of evil prior to this ? I have no idea....I can only say that THIS was the breaking point for me in my mind....I was then able to begin my evaluation of teachings ...ideas and perception aquired over a decade of association with twi. It was my first taste of actually freedom....of allowing myself to think outside of the tight little box that had been imprisoned in.....even though I had been away from twi for almost 5 years.
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Bramble
We stayed after POP, but then we didn't really know what was going on. We didn't read POP until 2000, when we found it online. Uur Way leader then was a good guy, the corps in the area that left were clickish and never had much to say to us, so we stayed with the group that seemed healthiest to us.
We left in the late nineties when our HFC got more and more into our business. Our previous LC had been a buddy of ours from the old days(early eighties) and our HFC was held back by that. Then we got a new limb guy, who gave our HFC his way.
Leaving or letting this creepy guy run us into the ground were our only options. We left.
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topoftheworld
"Bad Buns"
Funny. As good a reason as any, I guess.
Mine was complex, yet simple: in two separate instances, actions or words purported to be revelation by a MOG or WOG resulted in horrible pain and loss. I thought it was my unbelieving that caused their revelation to be wrong, so I left.
Turns out they were wrong.
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markomalley
The LOYalty letter was the final straw. There were a lot of other straws before that point in time, though.
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bliss
(((((((S N I F F)))))))))
((((((ahhhhhhh)))))))))
Do you smell that?
It is the sweet smell of F R E E D O M and the sweetness of a REAL relationship with G O D and my
S A V I O R !
That is what made us leave.
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